Why do people take metal so seriously?

[no country for old wainds]

I find that the people who tend to take metal seriously are the people who appreciate it as art, rather than entertainment.

'sup yo im a metal metalhead its who i am METAL UP YER ASS i wear leather got a motorbike y'know \m/' posts are about as clever as Linkin Park's lyrics.

 

[anonymousnick2001]

I like metal, but I can't see how people can take it seriously. It's not sophisticated or anything.

Like jazz, or classical music, that's sophisticated. It's something that's generally repected by society. I will have to hide my metal CDs from my kids, and only show them my jazz and classical, because I've decided that I don't want them to think of their father as a noise junkie.

Does anyone else feel this way?

 

[no country for old wainds]

I like metal, but I can't see how people can take it seriously. It's not sophisticated or anything.

Like jazz, or classical music, that's sophisticated. It's something that's generally repected by society. I will have to hide my metal CDs from my kids, and only show them my jazz and classical, because I've decided that I don't want them to think of their father as a noise junkie.

Does anyone else feel this way?

Absolutely not. Some metal is extremely sophisticated. If you judge how 'sophisticated' something is by following general society's viewpoint, you should be listening to pop music.

Why are you censoring the music you like from your kids, just 'cause it's different? Because you want them to be 'normal' (i.e. moronic)? You could teach your kids that metal isn't just noise, then they won't think of you as being a 'noise junkie'. If you censor something you know sounds good to you, from somebody else, that shows how little confidence you have in yourself and your tastes.

 

[anonymousnick2001]

Well, to make my point, I'll ask you this.

Name a single sophisticated metal band. Be sure to say what makes them sophisticated.

 

[SLAYER85]

i love metal, but i do other stuff as well. I am a christian, i love to go out and play golf, i love going fishing, i love shooting, i love hangin out with my freinds durin school and at football games and shit, but i mean i dont see anything wrong with hanging out with a band after a show and getting some sigs. I try to do it as much as possible and theres no problem with it, theres a difference between doing that and going and being a pest and being pushy with trying to talk to them and get sigs, i mean its all good but be polite and let other people talk to the band and get sigs and shit. And i think all this talk about how people are sheep for going to shows or any other get together is horse shit, yeah some people do it to find a ''click'', but im at a loss to find a large group of people who are losers like this that i know of, but losers are a plague and they are gonna be everywhere from the science club to metal shows to even church, everything can be taken beyond the limits of healthy moderation so its just something that needs to be controlled and not taken too seriously.

 

[no country for old wainds]

I don't have enough knowledge of terms in musical theory to describe why, but I can sure hear it. To name an album, Atheist - Unquestionable Presence.

 

[anonymousnick2001]

Hah!

Atheist were part jazz.

I WIN!!! Na-na-na-na-nah-NAH!

 

[andrew_plamondon]

First of all, what the term "sophisticated" means to you ? I could list tens of bands that sounds sophisticated to me, but you might say it doesn't fit to your definition of sophistication.

 

[no country for old wainds]

They're metal! They incorporated jazz elements into it, yes, but they're metal! Me 1, you 0.

 

[anonymousnick2001]

Ah, but before incorporating the jazz, they were unsophisticated.

I believe it's ME 1, and YOU 0

Hence, this is why Cynic and Gordian Knot are somewhat sophisticated as well.

Candiria don't count because they're fucking pussies when it comes to playing metal, fucking around when it comes to hiphop, and just fucking BAD when it comes to jazz.

 

[no country for old wainds]

Heh, sod off Nick! I can hear what is good about the music but ask me to describe and I go blank, I'm learning musical theory but I'm certainly not an expert. Atheist were jazzier after UP and they were less sophisticated because of it. There was no purpose, just technical proficiency without direction.

 

[andrew_plamondon]

Well, Guardians, if you look at how the riffs are stuctured, how the notes are put together, the jazz influence is really obvious. Plus, listen to the drums on UP, it's totally jazzy. On Elements, the drums was more stuck to the bass, it was because of the influence of Tony Choy's latino roots.
Again, anonymousnick2001, what does "sophisticated" means to you ?
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[anonymousnick2001]

Just because something is meandering doesn't mean...ugh, nevermind...

What I mean to say is that loud, raucous music is not sophisticated. Regardless of how eloquent writers such as Billy Corgan, Dani Filth, and Zach De La Rocha have been, it's the music. It lacks...I dunno, sophistication. It's something I can't explain. But something makes listening to John Coltrane and Mozart sophisticated, and Napalm Death and Blind Guardian not.

 

[andrew_plamondon]

Well, how can you tell it is sophisticated if you don't even know what it is ?
Einstein once said that if you're not able to explain a concept to a 6 year-old, then you don't understand it well.

 

[no country for old wainds]

Some metal bands show so much musical understanding, and so many ideas are expressed through the music. That is sophistication. It isn't noise, not to people who can hear past the production and the whole 'omg must be metal must be scary and noisy!' image.

 

[no country for old wainds]

Well, how can you tell it is sophisticated if you don't even know what it is ?
Einstein once said that if you're not able to explain a concept to a 6 year-old, then you don't understand it well.

I don't understand certain aspects well. 'Tis true.

 

[andrew_plamondon]

Well, I certainly can't tell what sophisticastion is either.
Why don't we take it from the dictionary :
sophisticate : "To make more complex or inclusive; refine."
If we look at that, then yes, there are lots of metal bands which are sophisticated.

 

[no country for old wainds]

I know I just contradicted myself, saying I have little knowledge of musical theory and then saying 'bands show so much musical understanding' as if I'm an expert. It's difficult to explain, sometimes I can just feel the structures and the rhythms and the tones just fit and come alive. Some classical music also does this for me. Jazz tends not to. I admit I'm not fully qualified to have this argument though so I back down. (H)

 

[no country for old wainds]

Well, I certainly can't tell what sophisticastion is either.
Why don't we take it from the dictionary :
sophisticate : "To make more complex or inclusive; refine."
If we look at that, then yes, there are lots of metal bands which are sophisticated.

Ah, but it depends on what you're making 'complex'. Cryptopsy are technically very complex, but they are a band that I would say is pretty much just noise.

 

[lord667]

Just because something is meandering doesn't mean...ugh, nevermind...

What I mean to say is that loud, raucous music is not sophisticated. Regardless of how eloquent writers such as Billy Corgan, Dani Filth, and Zach De La Rocha have been, it's the music. It lacks...I dunno, sophistication. It's something I can't explain. But something makes listening to John Coltrane and Mozart sophisticated, and Napalm Death and Blind Guardian not.

Maybe what you're looking for is the "delayed pleasure" thing. Unsophisticated listeners want nothing but pleasure from the first note to the last, whereas sophisticated listeners like to draw pleasure gradually over a longer period of time, or even from thinking over the piece afterwards. If you think about cinema, why is Mission Impossible 2 less sophisticated than The English Patient? Because MI2 is about lots of things blowing up constantly, and most of the enjoyment is immediate, "fire-and-forget" stuff, whereas "sophisto" films provide enjoyment on a measured and thematic level that is meant to continue after the end credits.

Actually, one of the best things I've heard said on the subject came from the unlikely source of Gene Simmonds, when he said something like "My music isn't art. Kiss are like candy. It tastes sweet, but it's not meant to last. Rock and roll bands who think they're artists are, at best, delusional."