...and America reformed health care.
- Thread starter roy22341
- Start date
That wasn't all aimed at you Roy, just general venting. And no, I don't think it's different, for the most part it's just the same old shit as the last guy. But I'm pissed because I thought it might be different this time.
John_C
formerly Skeksis268
I read an interesting article somewhere, i'll try and find it, but the general idea of it was
a mass survey comparing Americans and Europeans on attitudes towards government
Americans by and large saw government as controlling and an oppressive force, stealing their personal freedoms
Europeans on average saw government as a collectively owned entity there for the group benefit, however incompetent it may be.
a mass survey comparing Americans and Europeans on attitudes towards government
Americans by and large saw government as controlling and an oppressive force, stealing their personal freedoms
Europeans on average saw government as a collectively owned entity there for the group benefit, however incompetent it may be.
ParsonsMatt
Alas, Tyranny
Just a quick little numbers game I did:
If the government put one MILLION dollars a day towards the national debt starting today, and did not increase the national debt at all, it would take 32000 years to eliminate the national debt. The oldest know cave drawings are 32000 years old, just for reference.
If the government put one MILLION dollars a day towards the national debt starting today, and did not increase the national debt at all, it would take 32000 years to eliminate the national debt. The oldest know cave drawings are 32000 years old, just for reference.
P-E
Munchkin
ahjteam
Anssi Tenhunen
scorpio01169
Member
Basically here's the deal on all the hoopla. every president from 100 years have been talking about healthcare for Americans. we came really close with Bill Clinton, but the dems didn't have the balls to back him up. Bush 1 Bush 2 McCain all ran on healthcare reform as part of their campaign. not one republican had a problem with this. and when Bush 1 and Bush 2 got into office they ignored the healthcare issue...both with wars on Iraq. Obama runs on healthcare reform and is elected in part because of it, uh oh. it is the end of America. He and congress just passed a bill that they were sent into office to do. trust me most of the opposition is because of misinformation, some of the opposition is people are just so into their party that anything the other side does they are gonna scream and yell, and a little bit of this is racism, some people will not accept this half black man as their President. I actually had a woman tell me (a black man) in front of my face that we are not ready for a black man as president, she did say maybe someday...but not now. I'm not saying racism is the whole problem...but as you can tell from the protesters calling members from congress the N word and the nut case twitter calling for the assassination of Obama, it plays a little bit. the cries of the republicans was "we want healthcare....we just dont want this bill" well what were you doing when you had the house and the Presidency? Nothing. If not now...when? we can't afford it? well we can't afford not to do it.
P-E
Munchkin
scorpio01169
Member
One of my biggest gripe about this bill is that people who do not want/cannot afford insurance will be fined. Not a fan of that. IMO The aim of this bill should have been to provide a feasible alternative for those folks who currently have a hard time getting insurance or who cannot currently afford insurance.
scorpio01169
Member
I agree with you...the whole fine thing bothers me too. but something had to be done about the whole preexisting health problem. I have had my coverage canceled because of this fucked clause. and i dont understand why if they can take my money...to insure me, but when I needed them and they said no...why couldnt they give me what I paid to them back.
ParsonsMatt
Alas, Tyranny
Yeah, but government subsidizes a LOT of the payment for poor people and if you make under $14K then you aren't responsible for paying.
P-E
Munchkin
Well I was more referring to the beginning of your paragraph which said :
Lobbyism in the US is so strong, what's in italic actually are direct consequences of how insurance companies (and all the private sector) are too powerful in the Congress.
Same goes for climate change : the Energy Lobby did all they can to push back Obama's climate change plans. And the insurance companies lobby almost did the same for the healthcare plan.
I might pass off as an evil socialist to some
goggly but it's not a matter of being republican or democrat, it's a matter of common sense : everyone deserves health care and shouldn't have to resort to mortgage their homes to do so.
coldthrn
Chris Cauthen
It is good that the government will subsidize it for the needy. I am just not fond of the government telling people they need to have insurance.
I just hope that this bill doesn't fuck with the small businesses.
scorpio01169
Member
Well I was more referring to the beginning of your paragraph which said :
I might pass off as an evil socialist to some
There are going to be flaws in any bill that aimed to help people, I think we are on the right path though. one thing I would have liked to have seen is more accountability with those who don't work that are able to work. those who put themselves at medical risk (like smokers, conic drinkers, and drug abusers). I am split on if we should fund things like AA, NA or therapy to quit smoking, I don't know if they should be paying for that out of pocket. but as for people who are doing what they are supposed to be doing and get hit with an illness (like our Mr James Murphy, Thank God hes is still with us), they dont go bankrupt and homeless because they wanna stay alive.
scorpio01169
Member
and as I said in my first post....misinformation, none of those people knew what they were fighting against
While I haven't personally read this bill (I don't have time for it) my friend is reading the whole thing and has pointed out how things will work in terms of coverage.
Essentially, if you had as you guys are calling it "Obamacare," you wouldn't of had the money to pay off your $85,000 bill.
The amount that you're given per year per family is $10,000 and as an individual it's $5,000. Anything beyond that requires you to request a grant which you may or may not be given (and isn't exactly the most comforting considering our economy and even what this reform will cost us.)
They determine the amount you're given based upon your income, (much like the FAFSA for college financial aid.) If you make too much, then it's all on you.
Now there are definitely some great things in here like allowing people to get health insurance when they couldn't because the insurance companies would refuse someone that has a pre-existing condition. I think it stinks that that happened before, but in the long run, this seems like it'd create a lot of problems.
I guess we'll see?
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