chat, feelings, and random discussion thread

[6 Stringed Fingers]

Tri: That's why I said parents should give their kids different and opposing opinions, and let the kids themselves weigh each one of those opinions. Parents can express their own thoughts, but they have to make sure the kids know that they do not have to agree to their parents if they have their own valid arguments.

 

[Tritonus]

OK, I did not see that.... That I agree with

 

[Rincewind]

But it is also a parent's job to make sure his/her daughter knows the presence of internet sexual predators

My parents didn't warn me about any internet sexual predators and look what happened to me

 

[Tritonus]

Hahaha... Right you go babe. I would have done the same

 

[Rincewind]

@Tri: What? Fall for an internet sexual predator?! Or fall for UC?!!!

 

[hyena]

you're all completely berserk, and otherwise you're perfect. people do get emotional about their worldview, you know. i'm not going to turn into a peacenik for the sake of my children's indipendence, as much as villain is not going to turn into the hawk of the century. i'm going to try and moderate my reaction if confronted by disagreeing kids (or by a disagreeing partner, which seems to be what my destiny's about), but i'm not going to shed my skin. is this beign oppressive? or are we supposed to stop having personalities the moment we reproduce?

 

[Taliesin]

I think everyone has to make that decision for himself once they have children of their own. I mean, it's important that you teach your child values and all, without making your child a closeminded idiot, or that you prevent your child from making the same mistakes you did, without being overprotective.
I think much of this will be decided in the situations themselves, depending on how mature you think your child is. Also, I think it's gonna be different for each child, I for example have 2 younger brothers with 2,5 years inbetween and I think growing up must have been a different experience for every one of my brothers (neglecting the 4th here since for him it'll be entirely different)
I want to have kids and all, but honestly, I havent thought about what kind of dad I may one day be, or what my kids may be like and I think that's a good thing. I trust my judgement, Im confident my dad raised me to be a good person and stuff and that's what I'll pass on to my kids and that'll have to be enough. The rest we'll see then

 

[Tritonus]

Rince: Of course fall for a sexual predator who I met over the net... it is so me...

 

[Dark_Silence]

I think much of this will be decided in the situations themselves, depending on how mature you think your child is. Also, I think it's gonna be different for each child

yeah, the parents may need to reajust how they "teach" their children, depending on how the children reacts and what they learn outside the family (ex. with friends or schoolmates). Sometimes they learn great things by themselves, but sometimes they may also be influenced by not so good things.

 

[Delirious]

Delirious: That is indeed a problem. But it is also a parent's job to make sure his/her daughter knows the presence of internet sexual predators, how to spot them and protect herself from them, instead of banning her from the internet. (I don't think anyone wants to be raped, so she wouldn't choose that option.)

the actual risk should, i hope, be obvious to most. it still happens.

the whole sexual predator thing was indeed way too extreme to be a good example, though - it was simply the first situation i came to think of where there is an apparent risk for a conflict between the parents' view ("we need to protect our child from getting with the wrong crowd") and the childrens' ("i'm mature enough to choose for myself which persons are good or bad for me"), no matter who's right or wrong.

The same can be said for smoking, drugs, alcohol, sex, and other problems. Parents can show their kids the pro's and con's of each of them, and help them reach a logical decision. Of course, if the kid is too headstrong and stupid then he/she still needs punishment.

...these are better.
unfortunately, there's peer pressure. if you're a 13-year-old, chances are you'll think the cool kids (often the ones drinking, smoking etc.) at school are a lot cooler than your parents, no matter how good you retrospectively realize they actually were.

what if someone reaches the conclusion that he/she should drink alcohol because it improves his or her social life and that overshadows the cons'?
it's not that far-fetched - many adults more or less think the very same way, but i find it hard to believe too many parents would accept that as an argument. "go ahead and think for yourself, just make sure you think the right way" sort of takes away the point of not preaching.

still, i don't claim to have any better solution, or that parents can do much more than the things you mention. it's just there. but then again, of course most kids do survive a mistake or two...

blah blah blah, and goodnight.

 

[Tritonus]

I do not think parents should allow their kids to drink alchohol, but they are I think aware that often they do without telling their parents and I do not think they should snoop on their kids. It's normal to lie a bit and if their kids come home drunk, of course the parents shall be mad, but it's just very normal and if you show your children you trust them they will probably go easier on smoking and drinking as result of maturity and not wanting to abuse their parents trust too much...

 

[hyena]

@tri: i disagree on the first statement. societies that place no stigma on moderate alcohol consumption on the part of teenagers have lower rates of abuse, dependency and alcohol-related antisocial behavior. if people are educated by their parents to responsible drinking (which boils down to drinking in order to enjoy the taste rather than to lose control) they will not feel drawn to getting drunk as a form of transgression. along with many other italians, i have started drinking wine at home, during meals, and under my parents' supervision. this did not stop me in particular from developing alcoholic tendencies, but well, on average it does work the other way. and even in the particular desperate case, at least i'm not a binge drinker who guzzles down whatever just for the psychotrope effect.

 

[Tritonus]

Well, when I say drinking I mean 15-year old boys drinking turkisch vodka at a friends house and getting drunk. I think it is kinda silly to prohibit your children from drinking wine at home, at dinners etc, but I would not allow my kids to go to a party and drink to get drunk, but I think a parent must be aware that children do things without their permission and respect that they want to take responsibility for their own actions. You have to draw the line somewhere, but if your children crosses it without causing any damage there's no damage done. Get what I mean?

 

[Hiljainen]

i agree with hyena, my parents never forbid me to drink, i drank wine or beer sometimes at home, so i never felt compelled to get drunk just for rebellion, i drink mostly to enjoy the taste. i got seriously drunk just a few times and that was mostly because i hadn't drank in a long time and didn't quite realise a beer would have been enough at that point

most of my ex schoolmates were mad about pot too, mostly because their parents never talked about it with them and just forbid it, so they kept acting stupid just to get back to their parents. my dad used an approach similar to the alcohol one, even if he didn't offer me pot after meals i consider myself quite responsible about alcohol and drugs.

 

[Tritonus]

Your parents let you smoke pot!!! Hahahahaha. In Sweden that's is a severe felony...

 

[Dark_Silence]

my dad used an approach similar to the alcohol one, even if he didn't offer me pot after meals i consider myself quite responsible about alcohol and drugs.

same for me

 

[Hiljainen]

lol my parents didn't make me smoke pot, they explained me what it was, how it worked, and told me to avoid smoking it with people i didn't know or trust. what i meant is that they didn't treat it like the forbidden apple, so i never really got a desire to do it just because.

 

[Dark_Silence]

I tried to smoke pots a few times, but only when people I knew had some, and offered me a try. But i never felt like smoking pot besides those few times...
I mean if people I know have weed (which is not often), I may take some of it but i wouls never buy some myself or smoke alone at home.

 

[Hiljainen]

@D_S: me too (i was replying to tritonus before) i don't feel like smoking alone either, i do it sometimes, mostly with my dear friend, as a way to enjoy something different, like i do with a good beer or wine.

 

[Tritonus]

Is it legal?