Elementary school shooting

[LeSedna]

This is very true. I wouldn't say all mental disorders though, as someone who suffers from anxiety and mild depression, I shouldn't be barred the ability to own a gun because I do not posses the mentality to ever snap and kill people. I could only do so if I truly felt my life was in danger and even that would be a hard pill to swallow, same with any moderately sane person.

Though I do agree, why should a mentally disturbed person be able to purchase a gun, if they can't even get a plane ticket due to the fact that they can pose a threat to others on the place? It makes no sense to me. Of course, the mentally disturbed can board a plane in the US, but I do think that since 9/11 having flight marshals on the plane can really help prevent violence and hijacking and protect the general well being of those on the plane.

Sorry if I was not very clear, by "flying commercially" I was saying "being a pilot with passengers". No matter what you have in my plane, even if it's a uzi pointing at a head, you're not gonna enter my cockpit period (it's not even negociable) so I have no problem with (very) mentally ill passengers in the cabin.

OT : Being a pilot myself, I can tell you the 911 thing is total bullshit and is only done for people to feel safer in a 100% politician way. I don't see how a marshall on my plane would make a difference. No one is entering my cockpit, and even a grenade couldn't blow up my door. And the whole point of being strict about it is that even terrorists know it, so they don't even bother trying that route to get control of a plane. They can shoot at people in my plane, it's gonna be a bloodbath there, but still better than someone sending the plane on a building, or blowing up the pilots after we open him.

By the way, totally off topic, but US and especially UK are (it's non judgemental on people of these countries but just those who do those laws) totally retarded when it comes to air security. In UK, I can't even get my own 50cl water bottle with me. Seriously ?!

 

[LeSedna]

My main problem with guns vs forks is that a fork is not inheritly designed to kill people

 

[drew_drummer]

Once again LeSedna knocks the ball out of the park again. Well done sir, I salute you for a: having the patience to think this through and b: not flying off the handle and calling other posters a faggot like I would do because I am exasperated at reading all the same bullshit over and over again for the last however many years and from the same bloody people.

FWIW, no-one here is advocating an out-right ban on guns either. Just thought I'd point that out.

 

[drew_drummer]

but i do know that the 20 kids who were murdered and the 7 people who were slaughtered should be memorialized everyday on television, in books and in magazines but unfortunately the only name we will remember is the shooters

I don't think this is true. Those kids and families should be left to get on with the grieving process, which you can't do when you've got a camera in your face or an article in front of you about your dead child - every single day.

 

[Terminus]

The problem are not the guns. The mom left the guns in the reach of a kid with some kind of mental disorder. See ?

Mom control laws?

 

[LeSedna]

Once again LeSedna knocks the ball out of the park again. Well done sir, I salute you for a: having the patience to think this through and b: not flying off the handle and calling other posters a faggot like I would do because I am exasperated at reading all the same bullshit over and over again for the last however many years and from the same bloody people.

FWIW, no-one here is advocating an out-right ban on guns either. Just thought I'd point that out.

I don't think this is true. Those kids and families should be left to get on with the grieving process, which you can't do when you've got a camera in your face or an article in front of you about your dead child - every single day.

JeffTD does the job way too nicely already, usually

And yeah, no one talked about banning guns tomorrow. I myself am not a total anti-gun extremist. I even said I would probably have a gun myself at home since apparently that's how it works, but it doesn't mean I think it's how it should either

 

[Jevil]

+ 1 to Sweetnothing the comunist!

 

[Mutant]

No one will convince anyone here.
There always will be fairies who will refuse to leave their dream world and forever keep thinking that it is possible to use laws to disarm criminals, that if only criminals don't have guns then everyone will be safe, that it is better to duck and cover and beg the criminal (no matter if armed or unarmed) for their lives instead of just pointing their weapon at the criminal and asking him nicely to leave, that instead of defending their family and property, it is better to leave home defense to the police which might be 15 minutes away.

---
On topic:
Had the mother lived through this massacre, at least in Poland she would end up in jail for not securing her weapons properly - yes there is a law that specifies exactly how you should store your weapon in a strong box safe.

 

[LeSedna]

^
At least in my fairy world there is no mass murder of innocent people to count, at least not to that level, in a veeeery long time (highest I found was 8 kills more than 10 years ago). maybe it's luck, or maybe not and in this case I think I have a good reason to voice my opinion. I see no fairytale there.

No one denies it's the only reason why there are mass murders. It just makes them easy to happen.

I'm just repeating myself (and especially marcus on this very point) anyway so I'm gonna stop there on this very specific point

OH and btw, first thing you ever learn about dealing with criminals is to DO WHATEVER THE FUCK HE SAYS. Also, to never challenge him intellectually or with humour, to never look him into the eyes (makes them nervous and you know it's not a very good idea to make some stressed with a gun in his hand get even more nervous) etc. If you think the "best" thing to do is to have a weapon and point it, I'm sorry but this is wrong, statistically. Yes you might encounter the one who kills you anyway, but apparently most of the case you're safer doing that than trying to be the next hollywood movie action hero. Source : having worked at the bank, and working in the airplane environment daily

 

[jangoux]

So what do you suggest we do, arrest people before they commit a crime based on the fact we might think he's a danger? Do you not the think his mother protected him because of his problem?

Maybe in your world you would prefer the government take care of our kids now. And to say you hope I never have kids is insulting and way off topic.

To maintain the off topic slander you have started, I think you have a brain the size of a walnut.

Of course not. Kids with problems need attention from the parents, from the school...like I told you, my wife works at two schools and she deals with troubled kids everyday. Autism, depression, Asperger's, panic syndrome are seen on kids not even 10 years old! Those kids (or anyone, btw) NEED attention and help, need to be looked at with a special way - they're just not 'normal'. A lot of parents just pretend they have normal children and let life take 'care' of them. I mean, the mother of the killer may have had all the rights to buy guns and ammo but don't you agree this could have been avoided, or lessened, if he didnt have easy access to all those guns ? Couldn't this episode, and every other fucking massacre been avoided if those troubled kid had some kind of assistance ? Well, that's my opinion and that's what I'd do as a parent of two girls.

 

[jangoux]

Btw, I was reading CNN.com last night and some fucktard said something like 'Well, if the teach had a gun on the classroom, this could've been avoided'. Ok, great example for the kids seeing their teacher shooting someone down. Everyone of them will grow wanting to be Rambo or Chuck Norris or something.

 

[PhilTheBeard]

Btw, I was reading CNN.com last night and some fucktard said something like 'Well, if the teach had a gun on the classroom, this could've been avoided'. Ok, great example for the kids seeing their teacher shooting someone down. Everyone of them will grow wanting to be Rambo or Chuck Norris or something.

I wanted to be Rambo as a kid and I turned out pretty badass. I also grew up around gun's my whole life.

 

[Star Ark]

too much over analyisis from you americans. if that kid couldnt get his hands on a gun and decided to go on a killing spree anyway he wouldnt have killed 26 people unless he made a bomb/explosives. A nutcase running around with a hand weapon couldnt take out so many people so quickly. get rid of the guns. why do some americans defend the right to posses one? i know its a cultural thing but it makes no sesne over here in australia.

 

[Loren Littlejohn]

Also irregually inspections to make sure it is like that at all times.

I heard this illogical idea in another forum. So Americans should just accept some idiot from the government showing up whenever the fuck they like to inspect our homes?

This idea is fucking stupid.

 

[Mutant]

OH and btw, first thing you ever learn about dealing with criminals is to DO WHATEVER THE FUCK HE SAYS.

And you are 100% serious about it ?

Maybe your imagination is not dark enough here, or maybe you just went too far with your "WHATEVER".
"Stand back and let me rape your 5 years old daughter, or i will fucking skin you alive".
Is that OK ?
You can be sure that it is not the worst thing a real fucked up criminal would say to you in the real world.
But of course in your fairy land the "WHATEVER" would not include such a horrible thing and stop being real "WHATEVER"...

I am more about fighting for what is priceless to me, than letting such people decide about everything.

 

[MarcusGHedwig]

For the record, I don't believe guns should be completely outlawed, but I can't imagine anyone could argue that gun laws in the US in their present state are just fine, clearly some revision is necessary to the permit application processes, but I leave the details of that to legal experts

 

[Jind]

In response to RichS's post Jeff responded:

He shot up a kindergarten classroom. I think it's safe to say he definitely had a mental disorder. For the record, I think it's safe to say based on your previous posts that you have one, too.

+1 I notice the "previous posts" you might be referring to are now gone as are the thread they were in - that is if you are thinking this for the same reasons I am. Let's just put it this way, RichS is clearly for "gun control" as long as it's only certain people that get to keep their guns - there's a "revolution" coming you know

 

[Loren Littlejohn]

-We should put breathalyzer ignitions on all cars so nobody can drink and drive.
-We should ban all bathtubs deeper than 24"/60cm so less drownings happen.
-Certainly no pools either.
-We should hook up heart monitors to cars and slowly apply the break, turn on your hazard lights and kill the engine in the case of a heart attack.
-We should put Governors on all cars so you can't exceed the speed limit, the fuck does any citizen need with that much horse power to exceed the speed limit for?
-We should implant micro chips into all of our kids so they never get lost.
-We should limit how many cars you can buy in your lifetime because the more driving you do the higher your chance of accidents.
-We should ban all smoking because you are slowly killing everyone that has to breath in that 2nd hand shit.
-We should monitor everyone's internet activity for signs/plans of a mass murder.
-We should throw out all this stupid HIPPA crap, people need to know what the fuck is wrong with you so they can be safe.
-We should get rid of all knives longer than 2" and mandate they do not have a point as points are only designed for stabbing. Why do you need pointed knives?
-We should eliminate all guns that look scary and evil, everyone knows they are endowed with more killing power over their classic wood furniture counter parts. Wood is from nature and therefore ok, plastic is from oil and therefore evil.
-We should get rid of all drugs and alcohol, everyone knows people always go bat shit crazy and lose control on both products and I need to feel safe.
-We need to fund (through higher taxes) an agency whose soul purpose is to show up un announced and make sure you home is safe for everyone.
-We need to make all police forces like NY cities, because shooting 9 innocent people to take down one guy is the way civilized people run their country.
-We need to install a scanner in every airport that is bomb proof, but scans your body for explosives and detonates them. Risk eliminated.

 

[Terminus]

Hell just put a tracking chip in our brains to monitor our thoughts, it creates tons of jobs!

 

[Loren Littlejohn]

Hell just put a tracking chip in our brains to monitor our thoughts, it creates tons of jobs!

Shit I actually didn't think of this. Would probably be cheaper than all the shit I thought up actually. But I was going with the tech we could probably implement at this point in time.