New OPETH "Heritage" album streaming online now!

[DanLights]

I said it once and i will repeat...

Changing and "evolving" in music genres and styles is BETRAYING your old fans.

I'm sorry but this is the typical rant of a 14 year old kid who seems to think the bands should lick the fans' shoes and be totally under their command. Bands appreciate that people buy and enjoy their albums, but they are going to keep making music and years later they will be in a different mindset, mood, situation, whatever and they will not write the same album, will not follow the same structures, same lyrics, etc. If fans (the same or new ones) like it, great. The whole concept of "betraying your fans" sounds to me like those "fans" need to get laid and get a life of their own in which they can realize that betrayal is a really strong word for someone who's never even seen your face or even had any communication with you.

/rant

 

[locus_coeruleus]

That's valid, but it does not refute the fact that changing your sound is not necessarily evolving...

I agree with the "betraying your fans" bullshit, though, but the rest of what he said sounds pretty logical to me.

 

[DanLights]

That's valid, but it does not refute the fact that changing your sound is not necessarily evolving...

I agree with the "betraying your fans" bullshit, though, but the rest of what he said sounds pretty logical to me.

Yes, I agree with you, what I'm trying to say is that bands change their "sound" all the time like listeners listen to different bands and genres depending on the mood/occasion, evolving is simply a word that stated the difference between the different albums they put out. You can't possibly listen to the same album all the time, so you can't expect bands (who we sometimes forget are people, music lovers just like us) to do the same with the music they do and ultimately have to perform and listen to every day while on tour. And making a "side project" for every album makes it much harder to publicize, sell and play live, and without that bands don't survive.

P.S. I still haven't heard the album, waiting for my physical copy to arrive

Edit: and they won't go back and de-volve as mutant said, Mikael has stated he doesn't believe in the whole going back to your roots thing

 

[Mutant]

I'm sorry but this is the typical rant of a 14 year old kid who seems to think the bands should lick the fans' shoes and be totally under their command. Bands appreciate that people buy and enjoy their albums, but they are going to keep making music and years later they will be in a different mindset, mood, situation, whatever and they will not write the same album, will not follow the same structures, same lyrics, etc. If fans (the same or new ones) like it, great. The whole concept of "betraying your fans" sounds to me like those "fans" need to get laid and get a life of their own in which they can realize that betrayal is a really strong word for someone who's never even seen your face or even had any communication with you.

/rant

OK

Tell me the same thing next time when he decides to release a "falsetto rapping christmas carols" album !

Mikael has stated he doesn't believe in the whole going back to your roots thing

OK again.

No more money from me to him.

He is rich enough already so he probably doesn't care anyway.

 

[DanLights]

OK

Tell me the same thing next time when he decides to release a "falsetto rapping christmas carols" album !


OK again.

No more money from me to him.

He is rich enough already so he probably doesn't care anyway.

Your comments are pointless. If he releases a rapping christmas carols album (I'm pretty sure he's said he hates rap but that's beyond the point) I most likely won't like it. Will I feel betrayed? Uhm, how can he betray me if he doesn't even know I exist?

No more money from you to him, fine, that's your decision as a consumer.

Some people have an attitude that bands owe something to their fans. They put out music and you buy it, there is no life lasting debt involved there. Me, obsessive as I am with bands I live, I sometimes even feel I owe so much to these bands, cause the way their music has enhanced my life throughout the years makes the amount I have paid for their music/merch/live shows seem like nothing, but that's just me and not something "real", just how I sometimes feel about it

 

[Mutant]

Your comments are pointless.

You just can't see the point yet.

If he releases a rapping christmas carols album (I'm pretty sure he's said he hates rap but that's beyond the point) I most likely won't like it. Will I feel betrayed? Uhm, how can he betray me if he doesn't even know I exist?

It is about trust, it is about hope.

When i trust a band will release something brilliant in such and such genre and they decide to spend months or years to make something that has nothing to do with that genre... i (and many other fans) feel betrayed.

When someone starts talking about how my beloved melodic prog death metal is something that immature and unevolved people grow up or evolve from, i feel betrayed.

Simple and classic meaning of the word.

Look it up in a dictionary and most likely you will see the word "trust" somewhere in the description.

Get it now ?

Some people have an attitude that bands owe something to their fans.

All talented musicians owe something to the world, we expect them to make music and sell it to us, otherwise the talent is lost.

From listening to the new album, i (and many others seem to agree) can say that his talent lies more in prog/death/whatever than in just prog/whatever in which he is just not as great.

BTW (tongue in cheek).
If we talk only money, then yes he owes something to me, i bought Damnation hoping that it will grow on me and now it collects dust in the basement... totally not my cup of tea and totally not like all other Opeth albums.

I don't have unlimited time to listen to music, i only listen to what i really love, so that round piece of plastic is useless to me (sure i could sell it, but i am too lazy to do that).

 

[Harry Hughes]

All talented musicians owe something to the world, we expect them to make music and sell it to us, otherwise the talent is lost.

Wow, are you are seriously THAT arrogant and self absorbed that you feel they owe you something?:Spin:
No one, from Mikael Akerfeldt and other fairly big name metal bands, to super talented dudes that just write music for themselves in their home studios just because they love doing it, owes you jack shit.
Go on, go into one of the official band forums and make a thread with the title "You owe the fans music!"
If they (the band) even respond at all, chances are they'd just go tell you to go fuck yourself.

 

[DanLights]

You just can't see the point yet.

It is about trust, it is about hope.

When i trust a band will release something brilliant in such and such genre and they decide to spend months or years to make something that has nothing to do with that genre... i (and many other fans) feel betrayed.

When someone starts talking about how my beloved melodic prog death metal is something that immature and unevolved people grow up or evolve from, i feel betrayed.

Simple and classic meaning of the word.

Look it up in a dictionary and most likely you will see the word "trust" somewhere in the description.

Get it now ?

All talented musicians owe something to the world, we expect them to make music and sell it to us, otherwise the talent is lost.

From listening to the new album, i (and many others seem to agree) can say that his talent lies more in prog/death/whatever than in just prog/whatever in which he is just not as great.

BTW (tongue in cheek).
If we talk only money, then yes he owes something to me, i bought Damnation hoping that it will grow on me and now it collects dust in the basement... totally not my cup of tea and totally not like all other Opeth albums.

I don't have unlimited time to listen to music, i only listen to what i really love, so that round piece of plastic is useless to me (sure i could sell it, but i am too lazy to do that).

I completely disagree with everything you said. No they don't owe you anything, you gave them money and they gave you an album worth that money, there's no debt left to pay, there's no "it'll change your life or money back" guarantee.

And no, talented musicians don't owe anything to the world, there's no contract that says their duty is to keep happy all the people that previously bought their albums or went to their shows. Granted, it's good practice most of the time to make music remembering what you've done previously in an attempt to at least keep the same fanbase, but that's for each artist to decide or apply as wanted.

And no talented musicians don't have the duty of making music and selling it, they do if they want to (why wouldn't they?), but they don't owe it to anybody, you sound like uncle Ben "with great power comes great responsibilty"

Now, I'm not trying to attack you or anything, just stating my opinion and I'm sorry for the derailing

 

[DanLights]

Wow, are you are seriously THAT arrogant and self absorbed that you feel they owe you something?:Spin:
No one, from Mikael Akerfeldt and other fairly big name metal bands, to super talented dudes that just write music for themselves in their home studios just because they love doing it, owes you jack shit.
Go on, go into one of the official band forums and make a thread with the title "You owe the fans music!"
If they (the band) even respond at all, chances are they'd just go tell you to go fuck yourself.

Yeah you posted that while I was writing my response but that's pretty much what I said several times in several ways so +1 to you mate.

 

[Mutant]

Yawn.

Looks like i will have dumb it down for you to understand.

If you want to keep your fans, don't do what Opeth, Metallica, and Morbid Angel did.

If you don't give a shit about what your fans want, do what Opeth, Metallica, and Morbid Angel did.

Simple.

I am bored by trying to make you understand, so EOT for me.

 

[Pedro Teixeira]

Dude, everyone understood what you said, that's the problem.

You don't have the right to claim ANYTHING from any other human being, unless you're a Rothschild family member. Why did you love Opeth? Because you fell in love for their music right? Music that they chose to write and release in hope that some people would actually buy it, you bought it, they didn't write anything thinking of you or anyone in particular, you think that they care? Do you write music you hate for other people to listen to? No, you exteriorize music from within you, from what you love and feel connected to, so your argument of "they owe the fans" is utterly egotistical and reductive. They owe you jack shit.

If a band releases an album you don't like, you don't buy it. PERIOD. You don't NEED to flame their choice of musical style, ethics, etc. It's THEIR lives, not yours, so they do what they want in THEIR lives, unless you're like one of them 14 year olds that LIVES for a x or y band and cry when you see them.

So no, Opeth didn't betray anyone, if you want to go to extremes, the maximum you can say is that they have "betrayed" themselves and it's still to much of a strong word. Opeth's music is exactly what you're hearing in this album, take off the death metal sugar coating and you had this, all the time since the beginning.

 

[CubanDude]

^ word. dont take yourself or a band so serious. get it over with and grab another piece of music you like.

 

[Mutant]

If a band releases an album you don't like, you don't buy it. PERIOD.

Really ?

Is that all ?

No feelings at all ?

No disappointment ?

No lost trust that they will ever come out with something you could like ?

No hope that they will come to their senses ?

Just "don't buy it if you don't like" ?

REALLY ???

Come on people... you must be trolling me...

Do you even like the music you are listening to if it is not a big deal when one of your favorite bands releases something totally different ?

Aren't you at least a bit pissed when that happens ?

Don't you want more of that kind of music ?

Where are your emotions ?

Yeah i know we are different and regardless of all the differences i love you all my metal brothers, but i can't fucking believe we are that much different... :zombie:

 

[JeffTD]

Of course we all get disappointed, but we don't turn into 12 year old girls having their first periods. Gently remove your tampon and grow up already.

 

[DanLights]

Of course we all get disappointed, but we don't turn into 12 year old girls having their first periods. Gently remove your tampon and grow up already.

Another wonderful paraphrasing of my initial rants. +1

 

[Mutant]

Of course we all get disappointed, but we don't turn into 12 year old girls having their first periods. Gently remove your tampon and grow up already.

LOL !

If you knew me irl you would probably say that i am the coldest person on the planet.

I just explode when i really care about something and i really care only about very few things.

 

[Jind]

I've found a review that pretty much sums up my feelings on "Heritage" and avoids me having to type out several paragraphs of witty and informative thoughts on it. So for anyone interested in (not that there are any) what I think is a fair and well written review of Opeth's new disc - feel free to navigate to this review over at MetalReview.com.

I think the reviewer understands the varied opinions on the disc and also clearly understands as a listener that Mikael Åkerfeldt follows his own muse with little concern for what is popular, or even what fans expect of his band. Personally I appreciate the artistic side of music where one creates music for oneself, not for the masses - if the masses enjoy it, bonus! If not, oh well. In the end almost all forms of art end up with some form of appreciative audience even if it's a new different audience than what liked any particular artists past works. I would probably rate it a point higher than the reviewer, but that's just my opinion, no more valid than any others.

Artistic freedom should be a common goal, unfortunately with it comes the possibility of disappointed fans. I'm a firm believer in being a fan of a song or even an album, judging each on it's own merits instead of on my expectations of an artist - god knows I'd rather make the music my muse calls me too rather than what is "expected of me", a goal that has caused me to hate some albums by artists, but love others, judging every song and album on it's own is perhaps a better way to be a fan - it's what all artists hope for I would think.

Just my thought through the words of another - good art should cause controversy otherwise it is simply populist driven pablum.

 

[DanLights]

You realize you did end up writing several paragraphs and witty information

 

[Lionwing]

Gonna be a crazy motherfucker and say that I love Opeth and thought that Heritage, whilst not being on par with some of their other albums, is a good addition to their discography and I'm really glad that those songs exist, because they are awesome. The end.

 

[Behind]

Even if damnation is my favourite album: it's the first time I get bored listening to opeth; it's the first time I force myself to finish an opeth song; it's the first time I stop an opeth album while listening it for the first time.

The album is ok in general, but it's not my cup of tea. I definitely don't like what I listened.