Stupidity of this forum

[Silver Incubus]

I don't see how this is any more laughable than the idea that something as complex as the eye(for example) came about through a series of random mutations over tr/b/millions of years.

Take a look here. You may actually understand what you are trying to talk about

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-misconceptions.html#chance

 

[hexwind]

and allah is not the same person/idea as Yahweh.

Allah is the one who's thought about as "the father of Jesus Christ" in Christianity, so it's the same God, just a different name given to him , i don't really know if Allah literally means God in Arabic and that word has been used to refer only to the God the Muslims worship.

 

[derek]

The grass is always greener. Even when I moderated this board, there was a veritable slew of bullshit. Granted, it was more academic, but we never got anywhere either.

May I suggest this is just not the best place for a philosophers forum.

 

[monoxide_child]

Allah is the one who's thought about as "the father of Jesus Christ" in Christianity, so it's the same God, just a different name given to him , i don't really know if Allah literally means God in Arabic and that word has been used to refer only to the God the Muslims worship.

in arabic "allah" is a contracted compound word, meaning "The God"
Islam was formed in an area where most of the people practiced polytheism, where as in Islam, "Allah" is not merely ANOTHER deity, he's the ONLY deity

According to the Koran (sometimes spelled Qur'an) the entity called "Allah" is the same entitiy that Judeo-Christians would refer to as "The Heavenly Father" but, according to the Koran, Jesus of Nazereth, is not "The son of God" because Allah has no son, Jesus of Nazereth is respected as A "prophet" but the Koran says the Christians have "misinterepreted Allah's words" when they began worshipping Jesus as the "Messiah", because the whole "Messiah" being prophesised thing was man "corrupting" the word of Allah

 

[hexwind]

in arabic "allah" is a contracted compound word, meaning "The God"

I don't think it's correct, what you are talking about isn't Allah, it's "Il'ah" which means The God.

Islam was formed in an area where most of the people practiced polytheism, where as in Islam, "Allah" is not merely ANOTHER deity, he's the ONLY deity

According to the Koran (sometimes spelled Qur'an) the entity called "Allah" is the same entitiy that Judeo-Christians would refer to as "The Heavenly Father" but, according to the Koran, Jesus of Nazereth, is not "The son of God" because Allah has no son, Jesus of Nazereth is respected as A "prophet" but the Koran says the Christians have "misinterepreted Allah's words" when they began worshipping Jesus as the "Messiah", because the whole "Messiah" being prophesised thing was man "corrupting" the word of Allah

Qur'an didn't say that Christians misinterpreted the words of God, but they edited them (see Constantine I and Christianity) which almost everyone agrees that Christianity has a lot to do with Paganism. And yeah, the three prophets of the three main religions asked to worship the same God, Allah.

 

[derek]

Well, the threads already a mile off topic already - as stated above I don't think the 'dogmatic scientist' approach is a positive one, so I respond appropriately

Indeed. Science is no safe philosophical haven. Overt fundamentalism, regardless of where you fall in any debate, is always a problem.

 

[OldScratch]

May I suggest this is just not the best place for a philosophers forum.

This seems pretty accurate. Perhaps, it would be altogether more realistic to broaden the scope of the forum to more of a deliberately "Current events/ideology/politcs/philosophy" oriented format. In other words, remove the singular(theoretical)focus on the "philosophical" and simply re-work into a forum for intelligent, informed discussion of a wider variety of topics.

While many of the above mentioned areas technically fall under the "philosphy" umbrella already, a change in professed "mission" or tone and indeed, title, may actually invite more participation, and a larger pool of ideas to discuss.

Then again, that may devolve into so much more nonsense in a frightful hurry too...

Either way, it seems plain that the interest in philosophy proper has waned or evaporated entirely.

 

[derek]

The problem being there, of course, that Death never recorded a song called "Current events/ideology/politics/philosophy".

 

[OldScratch]

The problem being there, of course, that Death never recorded a song called "Current events/ideology/politics/philosophy".

Then we should call it the "Regurgitated Guts" forum, naturally.

 

[Silver Incubus]

How about Empty Words? LOL

 

[Dak]

Take a look here. You may actually understand what you are trying to talk about

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-misconceptions.html#chance

This whole article looks like a lot of vague yet bold assertions (in general). To state that the origin is non-important is as ridiculous as is the assertion that something that no one is witnessing or has witnessed (IE: evolution of one species/genus/etc.) to another was happening constantly until man showed up.

And yeah, the three prophets of the three main religions asked to worship the same God, Allah.

This is part of the disagreement. YHWH =/= Allah.

Now I won't disagree that modern Christianity has plenty of pagan-derived practices incorperated thanks to Constantine and others. However, none of these incorperated practices can actually be found in the Bible, only loosely and vaguely tied in through world play and out-of-context word twisting, if not just plain ignorance.

 

[Silver Incubus]

This whole article looks like a lot of vague yet bold assertions (in general). To state that the origin is non-important is as ridiculous as is the assertion that something that no one is witnessing or has witnessed (IE: evolution of one species/genus/etc.) to another was happening constantly until man showed up.



This is part of the disagreement. YHWH =/= Allah.

Now I won't disagree that modern Christianity has plenty of pagan-derived practices incorperated thanks to Constantine and others. However, none of these incorperated practices can actually be found in the Bible, only loosely and vaguely tied in through world play and out-of-context word twisting, if not just plain ignorance.

I'd like to reiterate why I don't respect the opinions of religious. It is obvious they rather live in a fantasy world with supernatural then the actual fact based world we live in.

Even nearly irrefutable evidence is still pushed aside. You are a fucking idiot. You know not what you talk about. I at least have, and am willing to consider logical based conclusion about the origins of life, the evolution of those lifeforms in to what they are today.

http://www.youtube.com/user/TheAtheistExperience

Watch some vids from this Channel. You might find all your ridiculous argument being addressed.

 

[derek]

You get quite vitriolic about this, don't you?

Further to this, I think you're being overly harsh in refusing to accept the opinions of any religious person.

In my personal, and especially in my professional, life, I have met a great deal of religious men who have fine intellects, and certainly deserve to be heard.

If you, as I hope, actually mean mindless fundamentalists and those who cause harm through their beliefs (passively or actively), then I very much agree.

 

[monoxide_child]

This is part of the disagreement. YHWH =/= Allah.

i remember a few years ago, when someone (i think it might have been Norsemaiden) was absolutely convinced that YHWH was somehow a completely totally different diety than "the Father of Jesus" and that somehow these 2 seperate deities got merged together

on the other hand, it's actually in the Koran that "Allah" is the same deity as YHWH/the father of Jesus and that the Jews and Christians have just edited and "corrupted" the "words of Allah"

the Koran refers to Jesus of Nazereth as a "Prophet of Allah", there is a passage in the in the Koran that kinda looks like it could be "the sermon on the mount" and in the Koran, there are more references to "The Virgin Mary" than there are in the new testament

 

[monoxide_child]

I'd like to reiterate why I don't respect the opinions of religious. It is obvious they rather live in a fantasy world with supernatural then the actual fact based world we live in.

Even nearly irrefutable evidence is still pushed aside. You are a fucking idiot. You know not what you talk about. I at least have, and am willing to consider logical based conclusion about the origins of life, the evolution of those lifeforms in to what they are today.

i agree with you here, i've actually read the entire bible, both the old and new testaments including the Chatholic text that the Protestants say is bullshit, i'm more familiar with the texts of Christianity than most "Christians" but, i undertood it to be fantasy, i have actually read the Bible, but i read it in the same way that i would have read a fantasy novel

 

[Silver Incubus]

You get quite vitriolic about this, don't you?

Further to this, I think you're being overly harsh in refusing to accept the opinions of any religious person.

In my personal, and especially in my professional, life, I have met a great deal of religious men who have fine intellects, and certainly deserve to be heard.

If you, as I hope, actually mean mindless fundamentalists and those who cause harm through their beliefs (passively or actively), then I very much agree.

IT is definitely the latter. There tends to be very few of those intellectual religious people.

I do get frustrated when you think you are talking to a person and it ends up just being a brick wall.

 

[monoxide_child]

IT is definitely the latter. There tends to be very few of those intellectual religious people.

I do get frustrated when you think you are talking to a person and it ends up just being a brick wall.

my personal experience interacting with religious people, it tends to be stupid people

i've found that the people that worship Jesus Christ (as opposed to people belonging to non-christian religions) tend to be people that are feeble minded, using religion as a mental crutch, people that are religious because they are unable to function without religion

i vaguely remember some philosopher type person saying that "religion is the wheelchair of the crippled mind"

the brick wall thing gets annoying, i interact with a lot of people where it's totally impossible to have an inteligent discussion about evolution or dinosaurs or the big bang theory
especially here in "the bible belt"
here, i think, is probably the only place on earth where someone can say the words "What religion are you?" where what they actually mean is "what denomination of christianity are you?"
when people ask me "what religion are you?" i always tell them "I'm Wiccan", not really because i can push the rain and heal people, but just cuz i don't want to have to pretend i'm a Christian

 

[derek]

I studied theology under four separate men of the cloth, and each one was intelligent, articulate and analytical.

I get the impression you treat people with religious beliefs as one homogeneous entity, to be distrusted and disliked. I think that's a rather dangerous course to take. Religious men account for a vast amount of literature after the fall of Rome in the west right up until the enlightenment, and they're hardly idiots.

Separating these form your garden variety bible-thumping eejit, is something I thoroughly recommend trying.

 

[Dak]

my personal experience interacting with religious people, it tends to be stupid people

I think you are giving no-religious people too much credit. My personal experience interacting with the majority of people, religious or not, has left me with the impression that at least Americans in general are dumb. Which I blame on the parents/education system/pop media.

the brick wall thing gets annoying, i interact with a lot of people where it's totally impossible to have an inteligent discussion about evolution or dinosaurs or the big bang theory
especially here in "the bible belt"

That is a pretty vague statement. Your definition of intelligent is probably different than others. A much bigger problem imo is most "Christians" can't even have an intelligent discussion about the Bible. All religion is to most people is a social club.

 

[monoxide_child]

I think you are giving no-religious people too much credit. My personal experience interacting with the majority of people, religious or not, has left me with the impression that at least Americans in general are dumb. Which I blame on the parents/education system/pop media.



That is a pretty vague statement. Your definition of intelligent is probably different than others. A much bigger problem imo is most "Christians" can't even have an intelligent discussion about the Bible. All religion is to most people is a social club.

you're totally right
americans really do seem dumber than the people from other countries
and for most Christians, religion does seem to be nothing more than a social club/phsychological crutch