The power of Alternative 4

[mehdi.i.e.e.e]

Originally posted by pagan2002
well maybe if cliff burton had survived then they might have been a better band. jason newstead is a good one and that but cliff would have told lars ulrich to shut up. also he would have influenced the rest of the band in a good way. he taught james alot! still i think they can do whatever they like. it's their lives. and like they said at the dynamo, "we ARE metallica"
that's all. i never bought an album after justice and the 2nd and 3rd are my favourites.

oh yeah Burton was hell of a gifted artist that's for sure, they owe him very much. he had that skills and that attitude that deserved fucking respect. and as you said, they ARE metallica, and that's the point. metallica are now like ac/dc, iron maiden or black sabbath - legends.

my favourite one is still the justice album. that one had that straight in your face anger that was really powerful and that really hit me when i was 12 :angry: good shit!

rauha,
mehdi

 

[D Mullholand]

Ah, it's quite obvious that the three metallica-men are not into making music anymore. They've got their own interests, including showbiz and all. The M&M's waterloo was more like a statement: "look: I'm struttin' here with my guitar, and that's a real orchestra over there!.." It was not even their initiative, but Michael Kamen's. Metallica is inertia right now.

"Ride the Lightning" and "Load" rule.

 

[Eos]

Originally posted by D Mullholand
Ah, it's quite obvious that the three metallica-men are not into making music anymore. They've got their own interests, including showbiz and all. The M&M's waterloo was more like a statement: "look: I'm struttin' here with my guitar, and that's a real orchestra over there!.." It was not even their initiative, but Michael Kamen's. Metallica is inertia right now.

"Ride the Lightning" and "Load" rule.

You shouldn't judge then that harshly! Yes, they have their own interests now (kids for example... only James has got three of them *g*) and I'm also a bit pissed off that Jason left them and especially about the way this happened but if they weren't into making music anymore they would stop doing it. They don't realy need to do a new CD.. I think they're making enough money with the ones they did already..
And if some metal fans don't like the newer CDs than it doesn't mean that they are bad! Sometimes there is the problem that a band moves on and their fans just stay at the point they were about ten years ago. The same here with Anathema. If you don't like AFDTE then just don't listen to it! What is the point of trying to convince other people how "bad" it is?? Take it or leave it! When Max left Sepultura this band died for me! There's neither a band called Sepultura nor Soulfly for me. I don't care how they sound! But I'm also not crying about how bad this and that about them is!

 

[T'seek Unique]

Alternative 4 is an instant classic. Smooth, smooth, smooth.... lots of bite to turn you on your head-- beware!!

 

[yourdeadgroom]

Originally posted by Eos
But I'm also not crying about how bad this and that about them is!

I actually think it's a sign of how good a band is, if fans kick up a fuss about them changing. If I was in a band, it would make me feel good that people were getting upset- atleast that means people care. If you change and noone minds, well, probably noone liked you

 

[Don Corleone]

Originally posted by mehdi.i.e.e.e


sorry but i don't judge the quality of a song on its complexity or technical skill it requires. if i did this way, i would listen to Dream Theater all the day. i don't care if there are sweeping solos and crazy 9/5 rythm patterns in a song. all i care is if the music 'speaks' to me or not. so science has nothing to do in my tastes. how about you?

peace,
mehdi

you're missing my point, mehdi. i adore the "mama said" track. i have nothing to do with that. but me and a million other metallica fanss on earth expect more from them - and we are right because they have proven this with releases like ride the lightening and master of puppets. but now they chose to do go a bit more mainstream. and fuck it, i heard they are working with a rapper right now. that is outrageous. of course they can do anything they want, but this cant stop their fans from criticizing them. just like LoboUivante said, i -very rightfuly- expect the best from them.

and yeah, my fave album is justice, too. that album is DIVINE!

 

[mehdi.i.e.e.e]

i totally agree with Eos there. if you like it - fine. if you don't - who cares? i don't find it outrageous that they now play with a rapper, what i find outrageous is to be so narrow minded when it comes to evolution and moving on. if you had heard Load when you were 8 years old, you'd love it all your life. it's all linked to personnal experiences and each of us has his own story.

and thinking that most of the fans think like you makes you right is a lack of personnality. the majority hasn't the right opinion, as there are no right opinions. show some respect will you

and as Eos said, there's no point in trying to convince somebody that you're right and he's wrong when it comes to art

rauha,
mehdi

 

[Don Corleone]

bah, there's no arguing with you. you still dont understand what i say. im saying I LOVE THE LOAD ALBUM. but i also know metallica can do better than that.

and yes, it is outrageous for me that they are working with a rapper.

and dont blabber such shit as "lack of personality". you dont know me. and it makes me wonder about YOUR personality when you judge a person by just a few lines they have written on a message board.

and you also know that im not the first person on earth to say these about metallica. it may be sad for you, many think like i do. just type in "metallica" on yahoo and see how many anti-metallica sites you'll get.

and im not being disrespectful. im just criticizing. show me a single word i said that is disrespectful towards metallica. im just criticizing - and i just realized this is not the first time im saying this to you.

 

[mehdi.i.e.e.e]

Originally posted by Don Corleone
bah, there's no arguing with you. you still dont understand what i say. im saying I LOVE THE LOAD ALBUM. but i also know metallica can do better than that.

and yes, it is outrageous for me that they are working with a rapper.

i think the problem with you mate is that you things that bands belong to their fans. i myself prefer a band who plays something it likes but that doesn't please me, than a band who plays something fans/labels/press expect and pleases me.

i prefer the Justice album too, and i guess that rap stuff they'll do will not please me, but whatever, that's their choice, they do whatever they want. if i don't like it, somebody will like it more than me, and that's all.

i haven't signed any contract with metallica to tell them to play something that please me, and i doubt you did. so let them do whatever they want and stop believing your opinion is the absolute truth or whatever.

and dont blabber such shit as "lack of personality". you dont know me. and it makes me wonder about YOUR personality when you judge a person by just a few lines they have written on a message board.

i'm not judging you as a person, i'm only judging the opinions you express there. and if you think an opinion is the right one because it's the most expressed among people, then i'm starting to wonder what kind of person you are. but i'm not judging you in anyway. as you said, you can't judge somebody from a few lines written on a message board.

and you also know that im not the first person on earth to say these about metallica. it may be sad for you, many think like i do. just type in "metallica" on yahoo and see how many anti-metallica sites you'll get.

so what? if most people think differently than i do, does it mean i am wrong?

and im not being disrespectful. im just criticizing. show me a single word i said that is disrespectful towards metallica. im just criticizing - and i just realized this is not the first time im saying this to you.

that's that 'they-can-do-better-than-what-they-do-now' and 'nothing-compared-to-what-they-did-in-the-past-when-i-was-young-things-were-better' attitude that i kinda feel disrespectful.

no hard feelings tho mate

rauha,
mehdi

 

[LoboUivante]

The people who wasted their money on metallica's waste-of-plastic albums of late, the ones who were tricked by the band. The people whose websites, tributes to the band they once loved, were shut down heartlessly for "copyright infringment". The people who were knocked off of napster with extreme prejudice, many of whom didn't even have metallica songs on their computer. The people who loved metallica since their inception, and were betrayed by a band that decided it just wanted money and fame.
All THESE people care.

You want people to respect metallica? As soon as they start making real music again, and they stop doing it for the fame and money, as soon as they let people honor them in a way they see fit, and as soon as they stop having hissy fits over some inconsequential filesharing, then people will respect metallica again.

Napster:
People who trade the files and don't buy the albums would not buy the albums anyway, at least this way, people who might not have heard of metallica (though, who hasn't, they use so much money for advertising and getting their name out, I guess this isn't worthwhile) can hear their stuff. Alternately, they can listen to a few songs off an album and decide if they like it from songs that AREN'T played on the radio. Besides, they make most of their real money off of concert tickets and propaganda- sorry, I mean memorabilia.

Fansites:
This is totally inexcusable. Closing down your own fans' sites? No wonder so many of their old fans are GONE.

Official Site:
If you are a fan and want to go to they site now you’ll be obligated to pay. Good way to keep old fans out or to get some extra profit, we’ll never know.

Going soft and pulling out early:
Sure, many bands change, it's called progression. The Beatles changed a lot from their original boy band style, but first off, they were pop, and second, they didn't change to a boring, uninspired style, and stagnate. Metallica did, just look at the lyric content now then start counting the riffs and their difficulty.

Videos:
Yes, Napalm Death did a video, but then again, Napalm Death isn't recorded as saying that the band will never do an MTV video either. This is called going back on your word. Another betrayal of honest fans.

Cliff Burton:
Well, great bass player... but very dead now. Would he really stop the events from happening?

If they fail has persons they cant keep up a true band. Early Metallica was in the least, genuine. Last thing, im not trying to brainwash anybody, this is my opinion about this stuff, I care about Metallica, they got me into metal and I owe them some excellent times. Even if I try my best to look like I don’t care when “I Disappear” appears on TV its sad and really pathetic, just look at the “solo”. Kirk please forget about the Wha Wha, its killing your solos.


By the way some of this post comes from another discussion i had when i was 16 or something

 

[requiem]

I agree with most of that...

I think it's fair to criticise Metallica. Not because anyone thinks they are bad at what they do, but because we know what they're capable of.

And their anti-fan behaviour is bizarre to an extreme.

Sure, some people still like their music. Sure, some people still even like them.

But the difference is, some people know what metal is supposed to be about.

And it ain't dollars.

 

[mehdi.i.e.e.e]

Originally posted by requiem
[...]I think it's fair to criticise Metallica. Not because anyone thinks they are bad at what they do, but because we know what they're capable of.

[...]

But the difference is, some people know what metal is supposed to be about. And it ain't dollars.

baaah. what's wrong with metallica playing something you don't like? you guys seem really pissed at that band, and there's no point in being that mad. take it easier

oh and please spare me that 'i know metal is about' blah blah. if you want bands that play always the same 80's metal stuff, then check Hammerfall or Gamma Ray, Metallica ain't for you. i like when bands go beyond a genre limit, or at least, try. i like when a band plays something people don't expect from them.

that's because of fans who hate evolution and moving on that metal is getting that ugly crappy genre. fortunately there're bands like Dark Tranquillity, Samael or Type O Negative who try to come up with something a bit original.

no hard feelings,
mehdi

 

[Eos]

Originally posted by mehdi.i.e.e.e

if you want bands that play always the same 80's metal stuff, then check Hammerfall or Gamma Ray

BTW Cannibal Corpse did a "new" CD not so long ago
And the "new" Manowar was released just yesterday *ggg*

 

[Eos]

And BTW HIM (especially the "Greatest lovesongs...") is not gay at all!!! hehe
Actually "For You" and "Death Is In Love With Us" are my favourites

 

[requiem]

Yeah, nice one dickheads.

The new Anathema and Katatonia albums are two of my favourites. I'm up for progression... in fact I prefer it.

But Metallica haven't progressed. They've regressed. They're basically just another rock band these days.

And using Hammerfall and bands like that in your argument is pretty irrelevant... no hard feelings.

I love 'Ride the Lightning', 'Master of Puppets,' '...And Justice For All', and parts of the black album. So Metallica were for me.

Now they're for anyone.

 

[mehdi.i.e.e.e]

Originally posted by requiem
Yeah, nice one dickheads.

i was wondering who'll be the first to lose his nerves and to call me names. congratulations mate

The new Anathema and Katatonia albums are two of my favourites. I'm up for progression... in fact I prefer it.

But Metallica haven't progressed. They've regressed. They're basically just another rock band these days.

then again, this is YOUR opinion. and i know people who prefer 'Load' than 'Kill 'Em All'. does it make idiots of them?

And using Hammerfall and bands like that in your argument is pretty irrelevant... no hard feelings.

have you ever heard of jokes and 2nd degree?

I love 'Ride the Lightning', 'Master of Puppets,' '...And Justice For All', and parts of the black album. So Metallica were for me.

Now they're for anyone.

so that's what makes you sad - Metallica getting success? Metallica not being EVIL anymore? i find it cool that people get into their music, then try to listen to 'Master Of Puppets'. but if you prefer your music to be known just by the ELITE, that's lame. i hope i am wrong tho

rauha,
mehdi

 

[Terry Armageddon]

Depends what you mean by progression. A lot of people would say that Metallica have progressed from being 'another' raw thrash band to what they are now but it doesnt matter cos I aint bought nothing since and Justice For All. I thought the black album was rather cheesy and just marketable fodder.

Originally posted by requiem

I love 'Ride the Lightning', 'Master of Puppets,' '...And Justice For All', and parts of the black album. So Metallica were for me.

Now they're for anyone.

Ride the Lightning wasnt for YOU!
It was for me and only me

 

[requiem]

Originally posted by mehdi.i.e.e.e
so that's what makes you sad - Metallica getting success? Metallica not being EVIL anymore? i find it cool that people get into their music, then try to listen to 'Master Of Puppets'. but if you prefer your music to be known just by the ELITE, that's lame. i hope i am wrong tho

Are you serious? This is such a bizarre statement, I don't know where to begin.

No, of course I'm not sad at Metallica getting success. What makes me sad is the draconian methods they endorse in order to gain more success, at least monetarily. They're treatment of sincere fans and new fans alike is deplorable.

When had I suggested I wanted my music to be heard simply by the elite? What on earth are you smoking over there?

Anathema are changing, and I think that's great. I said it before, but I have to repeat myself to make you understand. I'm not anti-progression. I'm anti-greed.

 

[mehdi.i.e.e.e]

Originally posted by requiem
When had I suggested I wanted my music to be heard simply by the elite? What on earth are you smoking over there?

These few lines made me doubt actually : "I love 'Ride the Lightning', 'Master of Puppets,' '...And Justice For All', and parts of the black album. So Metallica were for me. Now they're for anyone. "

no you're saying the contrary. whatever

Anathema are changing, and I think that's great. I said it before, but I have to repeat myself to make you understand. I'm not anti-progression. I'm anti-greed.

what has greed to do with music? i don't care if metallica want to sue the whole earth, as long as they play music i like.

weren't we talking about music?

rauha,
mehdi

 

[thebleakaffinity]

The Black album was natural progression. And Justice For All was the artistic peak of Metallica (and heavy metal, really). They had almost nowhere else to go. I don't like the Black Album, or Load, or Reload, but that doesn't make them bad albums. They just aren't for me. Metallica has said time and time again that they're only in this for themselves. If you think they owe something to you, you're wrong.