The Second Coming of the Great Political Thread

[Krigloch the Furious]

the US doesnt eat the healthiest food either.

 

[Matt]

Population size probably has a lot to do with it.

 

[supseudonymous]

I couldn't imagine living in a country where the average life expectancy is just over 40. Think of all the people you know who would likely be dead or dying.

 

[MasterOLightning]

the US doesnt eat the healthiest food either.

Well you certainly don't.

Besides, way more people in Europe smoke than do in the US, and I'm guessing many countries have higher rates of alcoholism.

The US does terribly in terms of infant mortality rates as well.

The US does not have major population issues either. If not for immigration, the growth would be at roughly break even, as in a lot of Europe. The large expanse of farmland/wilderness in the midwest/west skews population density stats, but density is still way less in urban areas than in many other developed countries, such as Japan.

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

We also have a gigantic obesity rate

The truth of this situation is that despite high obesity rates, high infant mortality rates, increasing car crash/automobile-related/machinery accident deaths etc. we still have a very good life expectancy definitely speaks to a Capitalist healthcare system.

 

[Rabid Headbanger]

"There a lies, there are damn lies, and then there are Statistics." - Some limey whose name escapes me

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

Whoever he was, he probably thought science was evil too.

 

[MasterOLightning]

We also have a gigantic obesity rate

The truth of this situation is that despite high obesity rates, high infant mortality rates, increasing car crash/automobile-related/machinery accident deaths etc. we still have a very good life expectancy definitely speaks to a Capitalist healthcare system.

I don't understand in what way this is a unique correlation. Most countries in the world with socialist health care have higher life expectancies. To say that care is worse in those countries is a dubious claim in the face of that fact. You could try to control for violent crime/accidents/etc., which is definitely a factor in life expectancy, but I doubt those stats exist. (Nor do they need to, as life expectancy is generally seen as a measure of quality of life, not necessarily health.)

Given what we know, capitalist health care gives good care to a majority of the population, and socialist health care might give marginally worse care, but to everyone. I think if you throw out health-care-as-a-right arguments, the economic arguments for it are sound enough. It might hurt a small sector of the economy, but benefits almost every other segment.

 

[The Ozzman]

Yeah, he obviously never took a Stats class.

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

Right MOL, it's all really an opinion...there is no real right or wrong in this situation (whereas with abortion and shit, religious people are wrong ).

 

[Krigloch the Furious]

Well you certainly don't.

actually I dont eat bad at all. You should really shut the fuck up.

 

[MasterOLightning]

How many pictures have you taken with White Castles? You had it coming.

 

[Alter]

I dont trust Huckabee one inch.

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

You wouldn't even let ONE inch inside?!

Huckabee is a fucking fag. End of story.

 

[The Ozzman]

Same with Bill Richardson. Complete fucking moron.

 

[skeptik]

A lot of you are making the grave mistake of believing that fee for service health care = GOOD health care, which, frankly, for most poor people, is a crock of shit. A lot of people in this country who have health care right now are not much better off than people who have no health care due to poverty.

 

[The Ozzman]

A lot of you are making the grave mistake of believing that fee for service health care = GOOD health care, which, frankly, for most poor people, is a crock of shit. A lot of people in this country who have health care right now are not much better off than people who have no health care due to poverty.

Well, I guess you could say that it might be due to how their plan is set up, since some plans only allow people to see certain doctors (HMOs, I believe).

I don't think it's fair to say that ALL fee for service medicine is substandard in terms of quality.

 

[cookiecutter]

It's about as fair as saying all socialized medicine is substandard in terms of quality

 

[zabu of nΩd]

Good posts, all. I'm actually not sure where I stand on the topic - though I never really have been. There are advantages to either side, and a lot of it comes down to one's personal philosophy of how society should operate.

I'll still take your beer though Ozzman.

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

It's about as fair as saying all socialized medicine is substandard in terms of quality

OK, I can agree with this if we're eschewing the other post Ozzman made also. As vihris just said, it has to do with how you view society and how you think it is best run.