2008 Political debate thread

[...AndTimeBegan]

You underlined the wrong word. The key there is separation. And while this country was founded largely by religious folks, it was also founded based on the principal that everyone is free to have their own religion and no one is forced to practice any specific religion.

H

Actually, this country was largely founded by secularists, and even atheists. Certainly, very few of them were Christians and adopted that religion's beliefs. (whoops, guess this was already mentioned hehe)

Also Kenneth, nah... while there's some archaeological evidence of some of the stuff documented in the Old Testament, most of it is BS. There's certainly no evidence of Moses, Abraham, and all those dudes. Albeit, I think we should save this particular discussion for another thread.

 

[...AndTimeBegan]

My child does not need to go to school to learn of the homosexual lifestyle. .

Haha wow, I just noticed this. The dude is a beer nut who verges on clinical drug addiction but two guys kissing is AWFUL. "FUCK YOU FAGGOT, I'M GONNA DRINK MYSELF BACK TO STRAIGHT CAUSE I THINK I JUST GOT A LITTLE GAY FROM WATCHING YOU QUEERS."

If I was your kid, I'd run away fast. I'd rather live in the education system than a bigoted household as yours. And fyi I'm not gay, but just wow. haha.

 

[Burnout]

Haha wow, I just noticed this. The dude is a beer nut who verges on clinical drug addiction but two guys kissing is AWFUL. FUCK YOU FAGGOT, I'M GONNA DRINK MYSELF BACK TO STRAIGHT CAUSE I THINK I JUST GOT A LITTLE GAY FROM WATCHING YOU QUEERS.

If I was your kid, I'd run away fast. I'd rather live in the education system than a bigoted household as yours. And fyi I'm not gay, but just wow. haha.

I've never understood that mindset. Who gives a shit? It's not like having a non-straight teacher is going to negatively affect a child.

 

[...AndTimeBegan]

. With respect to intolerance of all religions, when you take the majority in consideration and neglect the fundamentalists, Islam is just as peaceful as Christianity. The Taliban is to Islam as Pat Robertson is to Christianity.

Islam is probably, by nature, more peaceful than Christianity. Hell, "Islam" in Arabic is loosely translated to "peace"! haha

 

[...AndTimeBegan]

I've never understood that mindset. Who gives a shit? It's not like having a non-straight teacher is going to negatively affect a child.

I wouldn't want my kid learning about the homosexual lifestyle if he's too young, but I ALSO wouldn't want him learning about the heterosexual lifestyle either haha. I mean really now, dude thinks it's so horrible to learn about buttsekks but banging a chick wheelbarrow style is perfectly ok in the schools. In fact, there should be a class just on how to bang chicks wheelbarrow style. And of course the dude teaching the class would have to be dressed up as Jesus.

 

[noble savage]

I agree with you both. Although, ...ATB I think making remarks like that is a good way to get this thread closed (Post #302). I enjoy these discussions! Just saying.

Anyway, I had a few gay kids in my high school and the two or so I met where nice. And not once did it corrupt me in some way.

 

[Burnout]

Anyway, I had a few gay kids in my high school and the two or so I met where nice. And not once did it corrupt me in some way.

As long as they don't hit on me I could care less, that's just one less guy that's after what I'm after.

 

[...AndTimeBegan]

I agree with you both. Although, ...ATB I think making remarks like that is a good way to get this thread closed (Post #302). I enjoy these discussions! Just saying.

Anyway, I had a few gay kids in my high school and the two or so I met where nice. And not once did it corrupt me in some way.

Sorry, haha I was just mocking the guy I quoted in a sarcastic and humorous fashion. I hope the mods see/notice that. Actually, it would be hilarious if I got in trouble for making fun of someone else's bigotry.

As long as they don't rape me I could care less, that's just one less guy that's after what I'm after.

I agree.

 

[noble savage]

As long as they don't hit on me I could care less, that's just one less guy that's after what I'm after.

Haha

I just don't understand the bordering on paranoid attitude some people have towards gays. If that's what makes a person happy, than I'm all for it. Two men or two women being together does not effect my life or anyone else's one bit. I think homosexuality is genetic and regardless whether or not a kid is exposed to it, they will go towards that lifestyle if it is "instinctual". I'm not gay, I don't have an ounce of gayness in me. I just really appreciate tolerance. Bashing people over stuff like that makes no ones life better.

 

[noble savage]

Sorry, haha I was just mocking the guy I quoted in a sarcastic and humorous fashion. I hope the mods see/notice that. Actually, it would be hilarious if I got in trouble for making fun of someone else's bigotry.

Yeah, I know. But it's the internets and sometimes it's hard to discern tone, intent and sarcasm. Especially sarcasm.

 

[Beelzebub]

No one has better gay-dar than a gay person. I have plenty of friends who are lesbians and none of them have ever hit on me.

 

[DoomsdayZach]

Well, i personally don't care. One of my best friends in high school was gay and had a huge thing for me and hit on me. Whatever man, i told him it ain't gonna happen and as long as he respected that, it was cool. I also took that as a perfect opportunity to just fuck with him. It was hillarious to me. now he does a lot of coke, but i don't think that has to do with his gayness. But shit, if gay people hit on me, that's pretty flattering. it's not like they're gonna come and rape you or anything in the dead of night.

It ain't the lifestyle for me, but just like smoking reefer, dropping acid or banging hookers, their choices in what they wnat to do doesn't affect me in the least bit, so I won't worry about letting it.

 

[Burnout]

People just need to care a whole lot less about decisions that have no effect on them; I don't get why people are so upset over a lot of issues that do not personally/directly effect them.

 

[noble savage]

Every time I hear Obama speak, I gain more and more respect for him. If there is one thing he is not lacking in, it is intelligence. He may be shaky/uncertain on how to approach some policies, but that's why I think he will surround himself with other knowledgeable people if elected.

[ame]http://youtube.com/watch?v=vPBxl53ZNxQ[/ame]

I can't believe I ever had any doubts about him. Politicians are, by a general rule of thumb, bottom feeders. Not so with him. I hope he wins!

 

[razoredge]

How would religion offer any legitimate solutions? We probably would be making more scientific progress if folks like Bush did not use their religious values as a basis for hindering progress.

Well you werent following along, I did not say nor anyone else that religion had "solutions". My only mention of religion was for everyone to quit crying about it and accept that is always been a strong factor in America and has nothing to do with politics. The media feeding into the easily distracted fan base has accomplished all this big religious/political drama. Much the underlying tone of my post you quoted for this responce. All the current problems in the country and its so easy to get everyone going off on the religion BS when its neither here nor there considering the real issues.

Of a different topic, Im wondering what some peoples feelings are of Hilter trying to create the "perfect race" and his/their attempts at removal of what they felt was undesirable ?

 

[razoredge]

Haha wow, I just noticed this. The dude is a beer nut who verges on clinical drug addiction but two guys kissing is AWFUL. "FUCK YOU FAGGOT, I'M GONNA DRINK MYSELF BACK TO STRAIGHT CAUSE I THINK I JUST GOT A LITTLE GAY FROM WATCHING YOU QUEERS."

If I was your kid, I'd run away fast. I'd rather live in the education system than a bigoted household as yours. And fyi I'm not gay, but just wow. haha.

'
This post was bullshit and all the backpedaling does not translate the above into this :

Sorry, haha I was just mocking the guy I quoted in a sarcastic and humorous fashion. I hope the mods see/notice that.

The entire post is out of line, the post you referenced and responded with mouthfuls of shit that said nothing was about school systems in general and that they feel the need to teach our children about same sex sex. It been a long running joke that sex ed has even needed to be taught in schools for the past 40 years, today its beyond a joke. HOWEVER today with all the attention whoring, drama, political correctness and general ball assed wankery, we are spending time and money "teaching" bullsit that everyone already knows all about while other aspect of education and social structure fall to shit.

Not that I mean to point attention whoreing or failure to focus on important matters toward your posts... or anything.....

 

[Beelzebub]

'
This post was bullshit and all the backpedaling does not translate the above into this :



The entire post is out of line, the post you referenced and responded with mouthfuls of shit that said nothing was about school systems in general and that they feel the need to teach our children about same sex sex. It been a long running joke that sex ed has even needed to be taught in schools for the past 40 years, today its beyond a joke. HOWEVER today with all the attention whoring, drama, political correctness and general ball assed wankery, we are spending time and money "teaching" bullsit that everyone already knows all about while other aspect of education and social structure fall to shit.

Not that I mean to point attention whoreing or failure to focus on important matters toward your posts... or anything.....

Talk about the pot calling the kettle black. You've said much worse around here, and I was surprised you weren't banned for it. Chill.

Moving on with the debate, I think sex education is incredibly important. When I had it, it was never "these are gay people and this is how you can be gay," and I don't think it ever will be. At the school I went to, parents could either consent to us having it or not, and the kids who didn't just had a study hall. No big deal. In a time where STDs are rampant and unwanted pregnancies are on the rise, sex education is necessary to help prevent these. Abstinence-only sex education doesn't work either. Girls who are taught that are more likely to partake in unprotected non-intercourse sexual activities, which also puts them at risk for STDs.

 

[noble savage]

Ah yes, the abstinence programs back in high school.. Did anyone sit through The Silver Ring Thing? I remember when the assembly was over a kid asked (After being told the obviously over exaggerated dangers of normal and oral sex):

"What if you use your hands?" The ~70 year old lady (Probably a nun.) didn't have an answer.

People have yet to realize one simple, fundamental fact. Teenagers WILL satisfy their urges to experiment, whether it be sex, alcohol, weed or other drugs. They should be given the facts and information to be safe, not told that they will die or contract some rare disease from doing something. That's just how kids are, and how they will always be.

Unless you happen to have an entire wall full of progressive rock CDs, that is. If a parent really wants their kid to be safe from sex and drugs they should take them out and buy them a few Flower Kings and Anglagard albums. Worked like a charm for me...

 

[DoomsdayZach]

yeah, I like what i'm seeing here about the sex ed stuff. I've never once heard anything at school about gay folk, the only thing i've heard is teaching general tolerance for all people regardless of religion, race, gender, or sexual preference. Being gay has never been encouraged in any way, but it just hasn't been scorned by faculty of schools i attended. And I hate to revert to south park, but they had one of the best points ever in the episode where Mr. Garrison was trying to get fired for being gay but everyone applauded his perversities and called him a brave man. At the end of the show he went on an awesome jag which i think holds up beautifully. He was talking about tolerance and how it's come to mean acceptance when that's NOT the point of tolerance. It's called tolerance because all you have to do is not make an issue. You have to tolerate it, which means that you have to just put up with it, not accept it or like it or support it, but just deal with it as a reality. I always thought that was an awesome point.

As far as abstinence, that is the worst idea for a lesson plan ever when it comes to sex education. I know some people don't want their kids engaging in these activities, and that part falls on the parents. As far as the education, kids should have an understanding of what is safe and what's not, what's going to protect them when they inevitably DO have sex (sorry parents, it's gonna happen). You don't want your son getting some chick pregnant and you don't want your daughters getting pregnant just because they wanted to experiment and didn't know the deal. As cheesy as it sounds, I'm glad I grew up listening to loveline on the radio because not only did I learn a lot about what is reality and what are myths when it comes to sex (that school NEVER bothered to teach me... such as pulling out is not a valid form of birth control... that sounds like a "well duh" statement but it's surprising how many people don't know this) but also helped me to learn what to do when you are with someone. Some guys learn their sexual techniques from porn, which is absolutely hysterical to me.

Basically, education is going to keep people safer than the lack thereof.

 

[Burnout]

Well you werent following along, I did not say nor anyone else that religion had "solutions". My only mention of religion was for everyone to quit crying about it and accept that is always been a strong factor in America and has nothing to do with politics. The media feeding into the easily distracted fan base has accomplished all this big religious/political drama. Much the underlying tone of my post you quoted for this responce. All the current problems in the country and its so easy to get everyone going off on the religion BS when its neither here nor there considering the real issues.

My issue is with politicians making decisions that are informed by their religious beliefs and hindering scientific progress in the process. I'm not saying all decisions informed by religious values are necessarily negative, but when it hinders progress because a politician feels like imposing their religiously informed morality on the rest of society, I take issue.

Beyond that, they can believe whatever they want to believe, just remain objective and don't assume the value set provided by your faith is universal.

There are a lot of real issues that get bogged down and hidden by unnecessary discussion of trivialities, but that isn't necessarily always the case and I don't think religion is chiefly responsible for any kind of distraction like that.

I think a lot of people are either uneducated, apathetic, or notably misinformed on a lot of issues. How you motivate three-hundred million people to do anything is beyond me, although kicking them all in the wallet simultaneously seems to get their attention.