2008 Political debate thread

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Kenneth R. said:
lmao at this thread, started by the ron paul guy. got no campaigning now eh? haven't missed much in the days i avoided this forum. i also have no interest in longwinded internet battles about politics, but would enjoy discussing 1on1 with anyone. so i guess this is a useless post then.
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Actually, Zach started the thread. Moderators merged some off-topic posts from the ron paul guy and other into this one. Dunno why they're at the top of the thread though.
 
Swabs said:
And that's how people like Bush get voted in.

What a wonderful system.
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I am actually impressed by Bush's leadership. I think it's easy to tie success and failure to what is reported in the media and the immediate-fix mentality of present-day society, and what looks like a dismal outcome to a war with a forgotten purpose; but, he has remained on target, not wavering in the face of public scrutiny by those proferring little else but postmodern ideals and criticisms, and not repeatedly flip-flopping to public opinion like many politicians in the '08 race.

I'm sure most will jump on me for those feelings, but I prefer leadership over political savvy any day.
 
ABQShredHead said:
I am actually impressed by Bush's leadership. I think it's easy to tie success and failure to what is reported in the media and the immediate-fix mentality of present-day society, and what looks like a dismal outcome to a war with a forgotten purpose; but, he has remained on target, not wavering in the face of public scrutiny by those proferring little else but postmodern ideals and criticisms, and not repeatedly flip-flopping to public opinion like many politicians in the '08 race.

I'm sure most will jump on me for those feelings, but I prefer leadership over political savvy any day.
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It's be nice if he won that election without a *little* help from Exxon Mobil though right? :rolleyes:
 
Progged said:
As for the military... We need these expensive toys, and more of them. How do you expect to have a strong military with equipment and technology from the 70s...
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Sorry for the double post but:

So why are these "expensive toys" actually needed at all? Unless you're planning to invade every country beginning with 'I' or something are you?... Oh wait..
 
Political contributions are a big part of the landscape in American politics. And oil is central to our lives. Anybody who actually has a family budget is well aware of that fact, I'm sure.

So are you condemning him based simply on who made political contributions to his campaigns?
 
Lets just say there is some rather striking evidence that suggests that Exxon Mobil could have played a very very significant part in the elections themselves, not just his campaign.
 
Swabs said:
Lets just say there is some rather striking evidence that suggests that Exxon Mobil could have played a very very significant part in the elections themselves, not just his campaign.
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I would like to see some evidence on this. I'm not saying you're wrong, but I have heard that before and was never able to find any information.

There is a book out by Kevin Phillips called American Theocracy. It's very well researched and it focuses on radicalized religion and foreign oil in America. In America we rely very heavily on other countries for our oil. Any negative shift in supply could cripple our economy. Seeing how Bush has many close ties in the oil industry, it wouldn't surprise me if many of these accusations turned out to be true.
 
Swabs said:
So why are these expensive toys actually needed at all? Unless you're planning to invade every country beginning with 'I' or something are you?... Oh wait..
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Are you actually serious? Or just trolling...? I'm sure you would be happy with the Royal AF using technology from the 80s and not developing any new capabilities... While your at it, go ahead and not stay one step ahead of all the hackers and let China have every bit of information about your security, TS info, etc... Pacifists... They humor me...
 
J-Dubya 777 said:
One more thing that completely disgusts me is the media involvement in the war. War sucks, but sometimes it's a necessity. Why do we have to have media imbedded with the troops? Referees? Why does everything have to be so surgically clean? My dad is a WWII vet, and I've heard plenty stories of him going town to town as well as fighting in the German forests (My dad was in that whole Band of Brothers scenario for a time). You shot at anything that moved. You didn't have time to care if it was a dog, a cat, a man, a woman, or a child in that darkened window. Could have been a machine gun nest. You see movement, you take it out. We're TOO concerned about collateral damge. When you have "civillians" accepting your offering of food, only later to hide under the cover of a mosque, and pop ak47 rounds at you should be good enough to stop the handouts, and level the mosque. War has become too freakin' p.c. for me. Let them do their job & hopefully get out& come home. With the current situation in Iraq, I have almost ZERO faith that those people are ever going to be able to govern themselves.....
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BTW, Dubs, it's called Law of Armed Conflict. http://usmilitary.about.com/cs/wars/a/loac.htm
 
Progged said:
While your at it, go ahead and not stay one step ahead of all the hackers and let China have every bit of information about your security, TS info, etc... Pacifists... They humor me...
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Why not........ our government and PACIFIST population seemed perfectly happy to give China, Japan, Tiawan, India, Turkey, Pakistan and Mexico our jobs........ just to name a few. Not to mention China and Japan our depleteing supply of natural resources......... and flooding our country with people we dont need, people that havent balls enough to make a stand in their own country to make it a good place to live, as our ancestors did for us.

I guess so long as our military jobs, program funding & government jobs arent threatened and investors dont run out of ways to make a quick buck...... its all A OK

export job and our supply of natural resources and import immigrants... WHAT A CONCEPT

Theres more ways than one to skin a cat.... why prolong the inevitable

people with one blind eye... they make me wish I had a rocket launcher (60's inventory would suit me fine)
 
ABQShredHead said:
Oh, don't get me started on jobs...

If those jobs that went to foreign nations for five cents an hour are the jobs you aspire to, have at it.

Somebody please bring me a cup of ambition.
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On the contrary, my job was for about 80K a year, when the company outsourced our drums & rotor production to China. Not only did their inferior cores fill half the warehouse due to OUR QC, it closed our core producing plant in Waupaca, WI. It was the start of many things that took the company's stock from $60/share to a penny stock before lots of people were laid off, and the company went bankrupt. It's not all about Naboo answering helpdesk calls in India. Foreign outsourcing nearly cost me everything I had.
I'm STILL climbing out of that hole...
 
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