About me leaving Bloodbath

[Heavenscent]

But thats not what he said he ment... even tough its excatly what he said, I was adressing his second post. In any case, you all vastly overestimate how much power lables have over bands... or for that matter fans. Metalica are still on EMI even though their last 3 albums haven't sold as meny copies between them as The Black Album did and they're still making shitty radio-rock. Therion hardly got dropped after Deiggal failed to shift as many copies as Viovon, The Gathering didn't get dropped after How To Measuer a Planet? even though it sold very badly by contrast to Mandylion and Nighttime Birds... Jeez even if Bloodbath were dropped alltogether because of poor sales then they'd still get picked up by someone else and aside from threatening to drop a band what can a lable do? What can fans do other than not buy an album? Nothing. You have no power so stop deluding yourself that you do, radio friendly lables might be swayed if 1/4 of a million people don't buy an album but when you're not expecting to shift more than 5 figures worth of an album sales become all that more obselete, so long as you amke the costs back... and since that usually only requires about 1000 odd people to buy an album I really doubt that any of you can possibly organise (what Im guessing) around 95% of Bloodbath's fanbase to boycott them.

As far as I'm concerned anyone who signes any such petition is far too concerned with whose in the band and not what they sound like... pousers.

My guess was that there might actually be someone at the label who likes their stuff and talks into them.
I don't think the Bloodbath guys are puppets on strings, far from it. But good conversations go a long way. Believe it or not, there are actually people working for the label. It's not an abstract concept.

 

[Baletempest]

Jinn:
a) Its not a love of msuic that makes you boycott an album you haven't even heard. It will still be Stockholm Death Metal, the slight (albeit noticalbe) variations between songs are not the only thing that makes a band good and since the bands core sound will not change then yes you are just being a fanboy.
b) Strange, I sort of knew that Metallica were a bit bit to be compared to Bloodbath, although IIRC I did mention 2 other examples in Therion and The Gathering... bands that also have day jobs and don't make millions.
c) Your band may have 12 fans but Bloodbath have about 12000, your opinion or even the opinion of 1/10 of them isn't a lot in real terms.
d) If they cared what the populace at large thought they'd probably sound like Nile now wouldn't they?
e) The only people whose take on the music matters is the abnd, what with it being them expressing themselves and them making the music.
e) Do I have the right to insist that The Gathering stop touring so that Jelmer can rejoin them and they go back to sounding like they did on Mandylion? Just because you bought their stuff doesn't give you a say in the band.
f) If people only went to see Bloodbath at Waken because of Mike then yes they are just fanboys and pousers, since a lot of people went to see Bloodbath because they were an excelent Stockholm Death Metal band then I'm guessing their want of Mike was more icing on the cake.
g) So music is jsut a product to you, something to be moulded to firt the demands of other people aside from the band? Thats not excatly a love of music now is it.

Tumn: Nor will it make them sound any worse, whats your point?

Heavenscent: And here I was thinking that lables were run by robots... Name me one example where a lable politley requests a band change some aspect of its sound or lineup and the band has complied...
Century Media:"Hey Bloodbath, please bring Dan back so the sales will go up again"
Bloodbath:"Ok, sure no problem"
CM: "Oh while you're at it can you go all Metalcore too so that you'll get on MTV"
BB: "Well if thats what our fans want then no problem".
CM: "Well actually most of them just want Dan in the band and don't really care about what it sounds like, but you'll get new fans doing this because its what the general public want, I mean look what happened to In Flames"

Alice?

 

[~random~]

actually, as the band's fans, we have quite a bit of control as a group if we all got together and protested.

Actually, how much of the fan base do you think this forum represents?

 

[FromHereToDeath]

50/60%...???

 

[~random~]

Exactly, it's like the Opeth forum. If three of them agree on something, then suddenly it's obvious that all Opeth fans are feeling the same way

 

[Tumn]

Baletempest, my point is pretty much that Dan is irreplaceable. His work will not be matched, he is a one of a kind, there will never be another Dan Swanö. The majority of the most well-liked tracks are written by Dan. Bloodbath is losing a HUGE part of their sound by making a poor decision.

 

[darcy]

I always thought of Dan as being the "main man" being Bloodbath, I'm pretty surprised.

 

[Heavenscent]

Heavenscent: And here I was thinking that lables were run by robots... Name me one example where a lable politley requests a band change some aspect of its sound or lineup and the band has complied...
Century Media:"Hey Bloodbath, please bring Dan back so the sales will go up again"
Bloodbath:"Ok, sure no problem"
CM: "Oh while you're at it can you go all Metalcore too so that you'll get on MTV"
BB: "Well if thats what our fans want then no problem".
CM: "Well actually most of them just want Dan in the band and don't really care about what it sounds like, but you'll get new fans doing this because its what the general public want, I mean look what happened to In Flames"

Alice?

I have no idea. I just say it might be a possibilty that there is someone from the label that actually likes what they produce. It's a straw i'm clinging to.
I don't see it happening either.
But I also don't expect the mars company to give me a lifetime supply of twix. But i still hope they do.

 

[Katatonica]

oh man for much love i have to Jonas and Anders the fact that such good musicians as Mike, Peter and Dan are leaving/gettin kicked out, makes me want to punch them in the face lol... and well boycotting the band to make the other ppl come back is not even an option...i hope bloodbath sound is not compromised,,,, although u can tell the difference with each one of the times things changed in the band...well good luck to all the affected parties

 

[SovietPower]

I will still listen to new BB shti if it ever comes out before making any generalization. But kicking out Dan was a shitty move. So I guess shit like Eaten is not "death metal" enough for Kata guys and its not in their "vision"...seriously just stfu..it all seems like a pussy money move on their part. Pos I want Dan back...

 

[Danny]

Very sad, some specially details will be missed on next Bloodbath..

I'm glad i was able to saw you with Bloodbath at WOA.

 

[Jinn]

Jinn:
a) Its not a love of msuic that makes you boycott an album you haven't even heard. It will still be Stockholm Death Metal, the slight (albeit noticalbe) variations between songs are not the only thing that makes a band good and since the bands core sound will not change then yes you are just being a fanboy.
b) Strange, I sort of knew that Metallica were a bit bit to be compared to Bloodbath, although IIRC I did mention 2 other examples in Therion and The Gathering... bands that also have day jobs and don't make millions.
c) Your band may have 12 fans but Bloodbath have about 12000, your opinion or even the opinion of 1/10 of them isn't a lot in real terms.
d) If they cared what the populace at large thought they'd probably sound like Nile now wouldn't they?
e) The only people whose take on the music matters is the abnd, what with it being them expressing themselves and them making the music.
e) Do I have the right to insist that The Gathering stop touring so that Jelmer can rejoin them and they go back to sounding like they did on Mandylion? Just because you bought their stuff doesn't give you a say in the band.
f) If people only went to see Bloodbath at Waken because of Mike then yes they are just fanboys and pousers, since a lot of people went to see Bloodbath because they were an excelent Stockholm Death Metal band then I'm guessing their want of Mike was more icing on the cake.
g) So music is jsut a product to you, something to be moulded to firt the demands of other people aside from the band? Thats not excatly a love of music now is it.

*sigh*

a) I never advocated the boycotting of nor did I ever plan to boycott Bloodbaths next album. In fact, I am looking forwards to it. Stop putting words in my mouth.

b) Good for you. Nobody cares.

c) Petty insults and arrogant remarks are uncalled for. I do agree that the individual fan has a very insignificant opinion, but when a group of people share a common opinion and protest, things are reconsidered. This is how many countries do things such as elect leaders and how corporations make decisions.

d) And what brings you to the conclusion that Nile is the biggest death metal band out there with the most mainstream sound? Last I checked, acts like Six Feet Under and Cannibal Corpse have become more accepted by the mainstream audiences as far as death metal is concerned.

e) Thank you for stating the blatantly obvious. Being the head of several musical projects, I know how the musical process works. HOWEVER, what's to say that composers and bands can't take a little constructive criticism? Did Opeth sell out when fans asked for more guitar solos after MAYH? Did Katatonia sell out after they decided to forge a completely new path with Saw You Drown? Did Opeth sell out after Jonas Renkse suggested to Mike Akerfeldt that Opeth should make a nonmetal album?

f) That is a fine achievement of stupidity. So by the term 'poser' you mean that they're really not TRUE fans of Bloodbath because they favor Mike to Peter? That's what I'd expect from a 9th grader. it's like walking into an Ice Cream parlor and then telling everyone who ordered chocolate ice cream that they're not true ice cream lovers because they chose chocolate over vanilla. You can't condemn people for liking one vocalist over another and you can't condemn them for basing their trip to Wacken, which costs time and money to attend, to see Bloodbath.

g) Read my goddamn posts! I was taking the economical standpoint of music and the labels that control them! Music is a business whether you like it or not. My entire argument is that if all the bloodbath fans protested, there might be serious consideration in reevaluating Dan's removal, ECONOMICALLY SPEAKING.

Christ. Get your head out of your arse and READ MY DAMN POSTS.

 

[Baletempest]

Jinn Most of what I have written has been in reaction to what you have written so I sudgest you read your postes before critiquing mine. To make you even more hipocritical you chose to ignoor and dismiss my 2 perfectly good examples because it suited you to pretend that other bands who suffer sales falls can only get away with it if they're big. Which is not the case at all as Therion and The Gathering both prove, I know no-one cares about them but my 9th grade logic tells me that they are great examples of undergroudn Metal bands that have suffered economicaly from fans not buying as much of their stuff, am I wrong here?

If its so obvious that you have no say then why are you talking about petitions and fan pressure? It defied my 9th grader logic please enlighten me. As for Nile well, currently Nile are more popular in a global sense, specifically in Europe than any other Death Metal band. My 9th Grade logic tells me that bands would listen to the fans (if they listened to them at all) from the areas that make up most of their fanbase, am I mistaken?

My 9th grade logic tells me that the examples you've listed are in no way the result of "constructive critisism" by fans since Opeth's studio diaries and interviews make no such claims, and if Katatonia had payed that much attention to their fans Circa Saw You Drown my guess is that they would have followed on from Sounds of Decay/Brave Murder Day rather than write Discoraged Ones... especially since SYD was limited and BMD isn't so more poeple will have heard it and liekd it surely? My 9th grade logic also tells me that people are more inclined to listen to their freinds than total strangers therefore a well informed friend will be able to contribute good Ideas (like Damnation/Deliverence)
Fan A: "Hey your music would be a lot better if you could get more Blastbeats in, I like Blastbeats and so do all these people on this petition"
Friend A: "You know since you've been going in a more Raw Black Metal direction whay don't you up the blastbeat sections between riffs?"
Fan A "Opeth should wear Corpsepait, I have this petition full of people who agree"
Friend A "No, Just don't do it, look what happened to Immortal"
Who do you believe Band Member A should listen to?

Well by my 9th grade logic I never said that people were posuers for prefferring one singer over another, I said that people are posuers for only wanting to see a band because of who's in them, eg "I love 1349, but Frost's not in them for their latest tour so I'm not seeing them because they suck without Frost" even though they will sound basically excatly the same. This is just worship of one member by my 9th grade logic.

And this is a gem:

I was taking the economical standpoint of music and the labels that control them! Music is a business whether you like it or not. My entire argument is that if all the bloodbath fans protested, there might be serious consideration in reevaluating Dan's removal, ECONOMICALLY SPEAKING

I never advocated the boycotting of nor did I ever plan to boycott Bloodbaths next album. In fact, I am looking forwards to it. Stop putting words in my mouth.

Well my 9th grade logic tells me that you are saying (with your own mouth) that you want to affect a band economically by not actually changing the amount of money you are giving to said band? I can see it now:
Century Media: "Bloodbath there's a problem, you're not making enough money"
Bloodbath: "Are people buying less copies of our album or something?"
CM: "No, its selling very well infeact but its just since all your fans want Dan back the money is just evaporating into thin air?!"
BB: "WHAT!!!"
CM: "Yes your fans got 300000 names on a petition to financially force us to force you into getting Dan back. The power of the petition has placed a voodoo curse on you so you'll be severely economically affected by their decision to not boycott you in any way shape or form and I'm afraid you're so unprofitable now that we'll have to yeild to them drop you unless you remedy this and soon!"
BB: "No, we stand by our decision!"
CM: "well then I hate to do this... *activates remote chip in Bloodbath members brains that allow the lable to control them*. Now what do you have to say!"
BB: "Egads! How do we rectify this, master?!"
CM: "Well you can either let Dan back into the band or kill your fans..."
BB: "Gadzooks! I haven't the time to be murdering people we'd better let Dan back in post-haste!"
Of course Jinn now I see the light of the petition. Oh woe to thee, how my inferior 9th grade logic and head-arse interaction have failed me and made me miss the power of the petition.

Good luck Jinn, you're going to need it.

 

[Baletempest]

Baletempest, my point is pretty much that Dan is irreplaceable. His work will not be matched, he is a one of a kind, there will never be another Dan Swanö. The majority of the most well-liked tracks are written by Dan. Bloodbath is losing a HUGE part of their sound by making a poor decision.

Whatever you think of their decision (and personally since I want to see Bloodbath on tour I'm ambivilant) its theirs to make and you have no part in reversing or affecting that. Plus since all of Dans songs are still stockholm Death Metal juts with that unique Dan Swano touch then surely it's not a huge part of the sound only a minor one that people (myself included BTW) will miss. Its not fair to the band to say tht they'll be worse off, they may find someone with their own unique touch, OK it won't be the same as Dan but they'll be just as varied and thats no detriment to their sound in real terms.

 

[Nuk3m]

...Its not fair to the band to say tht they'll be worse off...

The band itself has already taken quite a huge dump on those who tryed out for the vocalist position.

I mean really saying that you think they wont be as good as they were is pretty light in comparrision and just as opinionated and "justified" as their comments.

THE ONLY DIFFERENCE BEING that most on this thread said it in a far more constructive, polite, and even professional way. The band did not.



I dont know why its all going to this. This was a band i REALLY liked because i knew of Dan and Mike. It was good for a reason. It wasnt anything ground breaking. It wasnt technical. It really wasnt taken serious. AND they embrassed all those things, even the cheesy-ness of it. ANDD! they didnt take themselves serious about the project or themselves. (Though the is a difference between acting like a few brats in a band and being a professional)

The outcome:

Ass-rippingly good death metal. Straight forward and easy listening. Also alot of things about it gave me a chuckle, the circumstances it came to be. The whole persona they had cooked up. The BOSS HM pedals...

THEN:

Dan, writting catchy groovy riffs. Mike the best metal vocalist to ever live sounding like hed make satan his bitch. Just a fun thing that was awesome, not trying to be something it wasnt.

Now:

No mike. NO DAN. Band acting like a bunch of spoilt rockstars. Its now a "serious" thing rather then it just being for fun.

I mean you could hear the difference in the last album. RTC was just embracing the good things about death metal, the simple things. NMF was just trying to be something else. Most of the tracks were trying way to hard. And in my opinion there really isnt anywhere death metal can go without it being a fusion of styles, like Opeth and some other bands.

IT wasnt even about doing somethign different, its about doing what has been done and do it better then everyone else. THE CHEESE FACTOR.


This thing has just been taken too seriously and the remainder of the band just thinks they are the shit.

 

[doom_death]

Looks like they are in 'war' to me...it is obvious that posts by Swano are written just that fans think they are in 'good' relation...but it really isn't like that...jesus,in his words I can feel that he is fucking sad being kicked out like last piece of shit...and somehow,I really trust more to Dan Swano then Anders...sorry...

 

[Aaron A.]

I'm going to miss Dan's presence in Bloodbath, but hopefully the band still produces a great album (their touring is meaningless to me [aside from the profit they'll gain] unless they plan to come to Hawaii).

Dan... go make something awesome, like Crimson III or Moontower II. Or! Something new altogether.

 

[Blakkheim]

__________________
Bloodbath is dead.

oh ok... thanks for letting us know. we'll update the news with your correct info asap - don't worry the news credits will go to you too!

 

[Tumn]

Lol

 

[Akiman]

Ok. This is something I didn't see coming.

First of all, the only reason I can accept this matter is the thing about gigs, touring and so on. Maybe some members are more into touring and maybe not but it's of course pretty hard to make music together if some members think that the band is just a studio band and others are looking towards and see the road, you know. Still, if that's the only good reason and that has also something to do with lack of discussion then I just can't understand what is going on.

Other members have said what they have said, Dan has denied the biggest matters and still both sides just say that this is how it is, have a nice future, everything has been locked and there's no way back. I don't know in what kind of world we live nowadays but if this is how people are doing with each other then I don't know anything anymore. Why not talk about things and even if the band has done some things in a rush then does the band turn into joke if they just get back together, solve their problems and handle the things just like that. "You we're wrong about that and right about that" "Oh ok! Sorry about that, can we still talk about that other thing?" "Sure!" "Then sorry about this, let's move on and make great music again". How hard can it be?

Dan also commented already some things about his visions when talking about Bloodbath's music and future. I think he's thoughts were something like the same few yours back when I did an interview with him about Bloodbath.

As a result of the first album Bloodbath was marked in many palces to a pure nostalgia-project so fo you feel that the new album is a any kind of release from this given status?

DS: Of course the thing is that we play death-metal but I would call Bloodbath a pure nostalgia-band particulary after the second album even though that is exactly what it was during the first to productions. If we talk about nostalgia overall, for some time there has been too little this kind of true death-metal to which I think I am partially quilty. In a way I was in the Edge of Sanity one of the first ones who brought clean vocals to death-metal, It has been as big blessing of versatility because that style has been used a lot. I feel that Bloodbath is death-metal in its purest form even though the producitons variate from each other in many ways. Just horror and death from the beginning the an end but if you compare this to a horror movie I don‘t like the moment when someone gets stabbed in the back. Instead the best moment is a second before it. It‘s that kind of atmosphere to which I have aimed at in Bloodnath and hopefully succeed. It‘s suffocating and hard but at the same time musically working and metallic and of course brutal. The new album is probably one of the best, if not the best, pure death-metal album of whose composition I‘ve taken part and that‘s a thing that I‘d better be more than satisfied.

I remember that you have mentioned that death-metal is dead and apparently you would wish that Bloodbath would be among few others, like the title of the 1st album says, the beginner of resurrection.

DS: Sure, you can really see that from the title of the first album. I can think only a few bands that play pure death-metal without any softness. Luckily there are few like forever Morbid Angel, Vomitory, Dismember and so on but the common line os not what I like. Versatility is certainly not a bad thing in music, but it‘s sad when all the bands at the same time start to change their style to softer and looser. Then we are close to light music when there‘s nothing deat-metallic excluding the style on singing. Luckily few have keeped their style and we are attempting raise the head of this genre. But the fact is that flirting with the audience by chaning the style is stupid, which is why I respect keeping the lines for example on the Iron Maiden level. It has kept its style the same with small variations for nearly 20 years and it has not needed to change to a pop band to get success. Though Motörhead is not my biggest favourite I respect them because they have kept the same tough style all the time.

Do you feel that you are that kind of person who is stuck on certain things or do you try to achieve something new all the time?

DS: I think that I am above all a chameleon that changes it style when needed because of myself or others but still avoiding unpleasent situations. I‘ve never found myself a strong musical identity and that‘s because different music throughout my whole life. I can be a rock-, pop-, death- or a -proge-person but I always please myself by what I‘m doing. I know the musical genres that I like but I can‘t decide which one I like the most so I execute all of them. I hope that Bloodbath awakens this style which has gained some sternght among the past few years.

Because of the changes in the line-up and especially when talking about the new album the questions about gigs have popped out so tell to us all if there are any gigs coming or are they too hard to assemle?

DS: We tried to arrange either the present or the substitute of it to some phase of next year but then we noticed that the latter is almos impossible idea. We should practice, plan and adjust everything to make gigs really worth to look and not just standig around on one spot and just playing guitar. I could say that playing live with Bloodbaht is at least on its present condition impossible but not entirely excluded. For me this wouldn‘t mean anything, I could go on a tour with just a bit of agrees though I have a regular dayjob. The others make their living with music and gigs when there‘s not so much money and you should keep your family alive through the music. Touring with Bloodbath would me really great, but you should still stay realistic and realize that it‘s almost impossible when there are members involved from such bands. Of course there may be an opportunity when someone offers suitable tour with suitable charges when you don‘t need to worry about the financial side.

I gather that especially in your songs there are certain build-up elements familiar to your style such as slight acoustic and melodic nyances. Using such elements in death metal may seem a bit off-place but certainly very impressive, for example in "Eaten".

DS: Yes, I guess its my songs with such odd developments. I can‘t recall if others used them but from my own songs you can find them a few times here and there. I had this feeling that, even though our music is brutal, it needs some preparations to really reach its peak level. When you add some lighter elements among the more violent onces they will strengthen each other as they produce a contrast. In psychological sense this is very true with the horror movie element: its not about the moment when you‘re stabbed but rather the moment just before the stab and the moment when it starts to happen.

And so these elements amplify the strongest climaxes in songs, just like several other bads have done?

DS: Exactly! Amplification of climaxes is the exactly correct definition for this. Sure you can go with full-steam for extended periods but no one‘s stopping you from using stranger elements to amplify the effect. Getting too soft should obviously be avoided though and I am actually a bit confused by this condisering the current state of death metal. A certain rough-rougher-lighter-roughest pattern works a whole lot better than the usual rough-rough-rough but using it is still not a necessity which would be an obvious reason for it being quite rare. Coming to think of it, Entombed actually used this style a long time ago ever since their first album although not in acoustic sense. The rather unique Chuck Schuldiner did exactly the same in his own way and he really had some gorgeous visions.

The correct preparations indeed do amplify roughness but at the same create a certain atmosphere. Was this actually planned or did it come out "as a bonus"?

DS: Again I can only speak for myself but personally I always try to get an atmosphere since I consider other kinds of albums suitable for entirely other things. On the other hand I don‘t think others in Bloodbath were such enthuastic about atmosphere-rich music but a certain infernal nightmare atmosphere is present in the album more or less. Its not as powerful in all songs like it is in certain songs with melodic parts or just multi-dimensioal songs which can be found among the more straight-forward hammering in suitable quantity. This way the new album has more contrast while it still sounds as brutal as its predecessor.

And so on. I think there are many things in this interview which make the official statement even more confusing.

I saw few people saying "Stupid whining" but come on! If the band doesn't give any other information, Dan also seems to be pretty shocked and still lives with this thing and we all seem to be a little confused then how should we feel about this? Ok? I don't think so. I think it would be easier if the band would just say "We don't like to do music with Dan, we need to tour all the time and it's just not working in any way on musical and personal state" but they just don't. Many reasons are pretty empty and others are just that kind of matters which could be solved in 5 minutes long talk. Maybe Dan and remaining Bloodbath members understand this but I don't.

Few days ago I were dreaming about forthcoming Bloodbath DVD and third album with some new guy OR Dan Swanö on vocals and with great new songs from Dan, Renkse and Blackheim. Now I don't know what to think or dream.