Atheism (Do you believe in God? If yes, then why?)

[Έρεβος]

Well . . . all you theists: STFU u dum newbie n00bs!!!1one!1!one!~!! I am 1337 haxx0rz, gawd iz dah gheyy so h3 no exist. N000bzz!

 

[tgorle]

Thank you, for a ridiculously generic Atheist post. Even the stupidest Atheists I know provide me with responses that are less "STFU n00b!!" then that.

LOL...
ah, one of those people who pose as intelligent by using demeaning rhetoric to avoid even the most elementary rebuttal of fact. How spiritual.

You want serious?
Here's your chance to redeem yourself:

Justify religion over reality.

That should keep you busy.
Have a nice life.

 

[Horus]

I never said I'm religious, I just said that your post was a very generic and irrational. It was agressive, posed a direct attempt to demean other people who've chosen to follow religion, and ridicule them for doing so.

And you say that I'm posing as intellegent? I know that I'm not exactly "intellegent", but you know nothing about me, as I also know nothing about you. Neither of us have any right to call the other unintellegent based on what we post on a forum, but I am able to look at your response and call it ridiculously generic, because of the way you presented yourself, saying "You're wrong, now shut the hell up." If you really consider that kind of impulsiveness, agression, irrationality and simple disregard for anyone elses' opinions to be intellegent, then I'm rather curious as to what you consider stupidity to be. Not including faith.

If you're really the kind of person that considers being irrational and closed minded the only form of being insightful and profound, then I'm amazed that you don't find the Chat section more philosophical than this place. But hey, that's just my impression that I got from you. For all I know, you probably could've been reading books like Faust at the age of 7, or The Symposium at 12. But seeing the way you post just says to me that you seem like a closed-minded bigot with nothing better to do than to headbang and ridicule people of Faith.

As for redeeming myself, I have nothing to redeem myself for.

 

[Έρεβος]

LOL...
ah, one of those people who pose as intelligent by using demeaning rhetoric to avoid even the most elementary rebuttal of fact. How spiritual.

You want serious?
Here's your chance to redeem yourself:

Justify religion over reality.

That should keep you busy.
Have a nice life.

There are no rational arguments that attempt to state that god exists, but there are plenty of perfectly rational arguments that argue the rational possibility of the existance of deities [a deity]. To state that there is no way that god exist is purely irrational. Sure, you can repeat what has been said a thousand times in the thread already by saying "there is no objective evidence in support of the existance of a supernatural god, hence believing in one is not objectively rational," but going on a tirade of how it is so stupid to believe in god with dumb little quips of no meaning is both useless and ignorant. The individuals with half-a-brain in this topic will argue only on the basis of it being less likely or more likely that a deity exists, with "why it is useless and rationally flawed to follow a god, or a certain religion and why that religion makes no sense" thrown in sometimes, and have done such. The ignorants - such as yourself - come in and scream that god doesn't exist or that god exists, with no real argument to back your overused claims; some of these bursts have been short and stupid like yours, or long and quasi-intelligent like one a while back trying [and of course failing] to prove gods existance. So really, shut up--either discuss intelligently with rational arguments or shut-yo-trap. I, myself a strong atheist by the standards of modern religious terminology [though technically a pagan], find these stupid and baseless tirades even if in support of how I believe, to be quite irritating and tired.

 

[schivmeister]

Atheists are simply people who believe there are different reasons to their existence other than God & Religion. Some people think Atheists = Satanists which is bloody dumb because Satanists follow a belief system and they idolize a particular entity, and they know they have been created by a Superexistence and the Universe exists by the wish of a Supreme Being. They only idolize Lucifer because he had believed himself to be far superior than those made of clay, they idolize him because they see in him a character that managed to oppose God. They believe in someone.

Atheism itself cannot be classified as a religion. It may b called a belief system but that can only apply if the particular Atheist has a certain belief as to his/her and the Universe's existence. Some Atheists follow Astrology and think in terms of harmony of cosmological material & events. Some base Life on Science. Scientists can be called Atheists in general, during their study and theses (no matter what religion they follow)

You cannot ask everyone why they believe in something, because BELIEF is something that can just "be there", and it can b "just like that". So asking an Atheist why he or she is so may not prove fruitful to ur quest. Atheists have their own unique perception of existence. FYI, Free Thinkers are not Atheists by default take note of that. Free Thinkers tend to drift along and aknowledge a religion or two. They may believe in God or Gods, Deity or Deities. Some follow a certain cultural practice such as folklore & mythology time to time.

Human beings by themselves are lonely. One cannot live alone, so there comes a time when one may feel the need to have a spiritual, mental attachment to someone or something of "High Power", because the world is not such a place where u can feel 100% at home. If everyone around u dies, there is no1 else left to talk to. One needs a certain kind of belief to live in this world. I lock u into a cell for days without food and water and believe me you'll be saying to urself "SOMEBODY help me". WHO will help you?

Atheists believe they can guide themselves, so do free thinkers. Buddhists believe in enlightenment and one's unification. I do hope u know Buddhists do not "worship a God", and Gautama Buddha is not the only "Buddha". Anybody can b a Buddha and Buddhists will aknowledge him/her. They believe in a path, they believe in the wrong and right. They do point to a supreme being at some point, but Buddhism isnt about worshipping. Its more of a teaching. Hindus know their Deities will be there to guide them throughout life. Did you know that in all these religions, you can find many similarities? There are prophets/messiahs that u can find in Hindu vedic texts & Buddhist teachings that appear in the Bible, Torah, Qur'an; just with a different name and purpose.

Paganism, Nordic Mythology have much in common with today's religions. And nobody said the Illuminati do not believe in a Supreme Being. Who knows the lizards themselves who are living far out in the Galaxy were made by the Almighty. Mayb yes they run this world in their computers, and they made RELIGIONS with an S to confuse us mammals. But there is no stable theory that the species themselves DO NOT believe in an Entity which gave them existence. Scientists have learned that the Andromeda Galaxy is a on a collision course with our Milky Way..and dont worry that is not until 3 Billion years. But doesnt that tally with The End of The World? Science is beginning to prove Religion Religion has always had more science in it than scientists can now figure out.

Anyway all Religions teach you how to be a good human being. All belief systems tell u to live life. Lucifer doesnt tell u to kill urself. When you joined him, you already decided your life. But its never too late to re-think. You are who u are, this Life is yours, live it as how you would want to. Nobody is telling you what to do, because in this world, believe me you are alone.

 

[Seditious]

Anyway all Religions teach you how to be a good human being.

I'm not so sure about that. at best it gives you their opinion of what a good person is, and tells you to be that. sure Christianity says 'don't do x y z' but the bible isn't a poppsych self-improvement book saying 'the top 21 ways to not be a sinner,' it no more teaches you to be a good person than the law by saying 'you'll go to jail' teaches you to.

 

[schivmeister]

yes i put it in a wrong way. it should b more of "gives u a good model to follow" rather than "teach how to be"..thanks for highlighting mate!

 

[Valerie]

To say it's "lying to ones self" is probably not as correct as it is to say it's choosing to do that which best serves the individual from their perspective. Sometimes, you just want a bigmac and fries, regardless of the trans-fats. Sometimes in order to overcome our circumstance, we have to "lessen the load", as it were.

I like that analogy. But as I'm sure you know, not every single religious person decides to be religious because it is good for them personally. Most only believe it because their parents do.

Reguarding the "Atheist" label, I think it it just that. Atheism is not a belief. Agnosticism is a belief. The word comes from atheos, which in Greek means godless. A is the private a, which negates something, in this case, theism. A-theism. Atheism. There's no reason one that does not believe in God or religion shouldn't logically be identified as an Atheist. I am an Atheist. I do not believe in God or religion. It's that simple. If you don't like being called an Atheist because religious people use it as a derogatory term... grow up. And if you're of the mind to believe that Atheism is in fact a belief, consider this. Atheism is a belief like "Off" is a TV channel and bald is a hair color.

 

[OldScratch]

I like that analogy. But as I'm sure you know, not every single religious person decides to be religious because it is good for them personally. Most only believe it because their parents do.

Reguarding the "Atheist" label, I think it it just that. Atheism is not a belief. Agnosticism is a belief. The word comes from atheos, which in Greek means godless. A is the private a, which negates something, in this case, theism. A-theism. Atheism. There's no reason one that does not believe in God or religion shouldn't logically be identified as an Atheist. I am an Atheist. I do not believe in God or religion. It's that simple. If you don't like being called an Atheist because religious people use it as a derogatory term... grow up. And if you're of the mind to believe that Atheism is in fact a belief, consider this. Atheism is a belief like "Off" is a TV channel and bald is a hair color.

An interesting "sig" collection...but wouldn't a black Christ have had an afro?

 

[Seditious]

Reguarding the "Atheist" label, I think it it just that. Atheism is not a belief. Agnosticism is a belief. The word comes from atheos, which in Greek means godless. A is the private a, which negates something, in this case, theism. A-theism. Atheism.

while etymology is lovely, I think it's a bit besides the point.

Just as someone "loving wisdom" isn't 'doing philosophy' or being 'a philosopher', someone who is simply without-god is what we call Agnostic, and we have the word atheist for denial of god. there's no sense in going back to etymological roots and then replacing the words we use because of their origins. there's no sense in saying 'hmm lets stop using the word agnostic, use atheist to mean agnostic, think up a new word for atheist...' and so on. a theist believes in god(s), an atheist denies them, and an agnostic isn't against either, an agnostic believes it might be possible. why scrap the word agnostic, say atheists don't have the opposite belief, then think up a word for the opposite of a theist? why do that when we already have well known words in place?

 

[judas69]

I like that analogy. But as I'm sure you know, not every single religious person decides to be religious because it is good for them personally. Most only believe it because their parents do.

I could say the same thing about atheism, and adolescent rebellion. Everyone has a choice to accept or reject the value system of the family, the school, the society, or not. Religion, as atheism and any belief for that matter, will only hold as long as the person can relate to it.

As far as our tendencies and psychological needs and benefits go, it's primarily unconscious and personality dependent (in the broadest sense). Do I think your choice in becoming an atheist was due to many hours of deep philosophical and scientific study? It is much more likely that it's an emotional response instead, from some level of your psyche you've become oblivious to.

You have to ask yourself why you are an atheist. I don't think your signature for example, reflects a genuine, intellectual need to know.

 

[Valerie]

Well, personally, I don't see how a couple of humorous pictures on an internet forum can reflect any of my beliefs. At least those specific pictures. I used to be Catholic, because my parents raised me to believe in it. I don't feel the need to justify my beliefs to anyone, least of all a stranger, but I didn't just decide to become an Atheist one day out of the blue. If you want to know more, feel free to PM me.

while etymology is lovely, I think it's a bit besides the point.

Just as someone "loving wisdom" isn't 'doing philosophy' or being 'a philosopher', someone who is simply without-god is what we call Agnostic, and we have the word atheist for denial of god. there's no sense in going back to etymological roots and then replacing the words we use because of their origins. there's no sense in saying 'hmm lets stop using the word agnostic, use atheist to mean agnostic, think up a new word for atheist...' and so on. a theist believes in god(s), an atheist denies them, and an agnostic isn't against either, an agnostic believes it might be possible. why scrap the word agnostic, say atheists don't have the opposite belief, then think up a word for the opposite of a theist? why do that when we already have well known words in place?

There is more than one type of Atheist. If I remember correctly, they're called "weak" and "strong" Atheists. "Weak" Atheists don't have any theistic beliefs; yes that is comparable to Agnosticism, but just a tad different. "Strong" Atheists flat out deny the existance of God. So, the etymology of the word is somewhat relevant.

 

[Seditious]

There is more than one type of Atheist. If I remember correctly, they're called "weak" and "strong" Atheists. "Weak" Atheists don't have any theistic beliefs; yes that is comparable to Agnosticism, but just a tad different. "Strong" Atheists flat out deny the existance of God. So, the etymology of the word is somewhat relevant.

we have the word 'agnostic' for what you call a 'weak atheist' and the word 'atheist' for an 'atheist'

you may as well say a gay guy is a 'weak woman' and an actual female is a 'strong woman' if you want to act like degrees of one word. suplimentary prefixes, are better than two distinct words

 

[Valerie]

Weak atheism (also called negative atheism) is the absence of belief in the existence of deities, without the belief that deities are non-existent. Weak atheism contrasts with strong atheism, which is the belief that no deities exist, and with theism, which is the belief that there is at least one deity. Weak atheism may either be a form of explicit atheism, that is, a conscious rejection of belief in deities, or implicit atheism, an absence of belief in deities without a conscious rejection of theism.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Agnosticism is the belief that it is impossible to know if there is a supreme being or not.

 

[Seditious]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but Agnosticism is the belief that it is impossible to know if there is a supreme being or not.

most people are agnostic until they find it possible to believe one way or the other. that they haven't achieved it doesn't mean it is impossible. it's a default for anyone who doesn't know. you could be agnostic saying 'its impossible, thus I will always be agnostic' but it's not required. it is for both those to whom the answer is unknown, or those who think the answer is unknowable.

this 'strong' 'weak' shit I've read used on the internet, but I've never heard anyone I know or any professor speak in terms of 'strong' and 'weak,' and it's my inclination to think people call themselves 'atheists' who would on scrutiny explain they are 'weak atheists' rather than calling themselves 'Agnostics' or 'weak atheists' because they just want an excuse to consider themselves atheists, they're agnostics who don't want to be considered agnostic but have no ground to be called anything else. If you believe it's unknowable then you are agnostic, and if you don't know either way, then you are agnostic. and if you want to call yourself an atheist then to that I may as well say I'm a genius (but really what I mean is I'm a weak genius not a strong genius, weak genius just means normal to me, I want to use the word you have connotations for and say I don't use it for those connotations). also, I'm a strong man (but I mean weak strong not strong strong which is the kind of strong which is actually strong)

infact, you make a good point, but by that I mean a weak good point not a strong good point which is actually a good point.

 

[judas69]

Well, personally, I don't see how a couple of humorous pictures on an internet forum can reflect any of my beliefs. At least those specific pictures.

I used to be Catholic, because my parents raised me to believe in it. I don't feel the need to justify my beliefs to anyone, least of all a stranger, but I didn't just decide to become an Atheist one day out of the blue.

Everything we do reflects our beliefs, unless of course we act to deceive. Making a mockery of religion and Christianity and scoffing at the beliefs of others is not a mark of maturity and does not reflect a true concern for the topic. It is true, you could just be an emotional person (which is probably the case) and still have very good reasons for what you believe, but I think it's more about relating to the music you love and the need to create an identity different from that of your parents.

Oh, and you don't have to discuss your beliefs, but this is kind of what we do here.

 

[Έρεβος]

we have the word 'agnostic' for what you call a 'weak atheist' and the word 'atheist' for an 'atheist'

you may as well say a gay guy is a 'weak woman' and an actual female is a 'strong woman' if you want to act like degrees of one word. suplimentary prefixes, are better than two distinct words

Hahaha, not quite.

Atheism simply means lack of belief in god - there is no inherant certainty in the term "atheist." Rather, atheism simply means you are not a theist, not that you deny the possibility of a deity existing (or "Strong Atheist"). Most atheists simply see that the truth of their being absolutely no evidence or logic in support of theistic belief - hence lack such beliefs. You have made the common mistake of defining "agnostic" as something uncertain. Agnosticism simply means that you accept that divine existance can neither be proven or disproven objectively - a quite obvious fact. Agnostic to me is a synonym for "not incredibly ignorant," and any atheist with half a brain is also agnostic (hence "weak atheist"). Agnostic is not something that can in itself describe someones system of belief, as it infers to nothing beyond a simple acceptance of obvious logic (that in the modern world doesn't seem to be as obvious as it should, as there are many a "faithful" fool). "Strong atheists" are close-minded ignorants, "weak atheists" aren't - at least in this regard.

 

[Valerie]

Everything we do reflects our beliefs, unless of course we act to deceive. Making a mockery of religion and Christianity and scoffing at the beliefs of others is not a mark of maturity and does not reflect a true concern for the topic. It is true, you could just be an emotional person (which is probably the case) and still have very good reasons for what you believe, but I think it's more about relating to the music you love and the need to create an identity different from that of your parents.

Oh, and you don't have to discuss your beliefs, but this is kind of what we do here.

So by your logic, I can determine that you have a religion by evidence that you ate a ham sandwhich. People make mockery's out of everything, what does it matter if it is of religion? And who says one has to be mature about it? I'm beginning to think you do not have a sense of humor. I do. I didn't create the original image, I only edited a word (I put Battleheart instead of Kanye West, I found the picture on his article in Uncyclopedia).

I do not like that you assume so much about me, when you know so little. I was an Atheist well before I started listening to metal (I started listening to it two years ago). I am 21 now (22 in January) and have been an Atheist since I was 13. You are right to think (not assume) that it may have been a teen rebellion against my parents, because that is a likely possibility. It wasn't a rebellion against my parents, as I had concern over what they would think. I love my family and do not wish to be distanced from them. You said before that people should make the right choice for themselves, and becoming an Atheist was the right choice for me. I'm not denying that religion teaches valuable lessons (the last 7 ten commandments for example), however I do not need the rest of it in my life. As well as determining that, I've determined that for me, faith isn't enough to believe in God.

You have also assumed that I scoff at the beliefs theists have, and while I may do that occasionally in jest, I am seldom ever serious, unless I am talking about extremists whose actions (influenced by beliefs) are a threat to humanity (I'm sure you can come up with an example for yourself). I am perfectly fine with people having the beliefs they have, and I have never challanged anyone based on their religion. My only wish is that America would become as accepting as Scandinavia, and that people would keep their beliefs personal and to themselves. Believe it or not I do not prance around proclaiming my lack of religion, except of course if someone asks (but I still don't prance )

Now please stop assuming so much, which is obviously so far based on an irrelevant facade of my entire existance.

 

[Seditious]

Oh, and you don't have to discuss your beliefs, but this is kind of what we do here.

yea seriously. as I noted to the troll some pages back, where're not here to take a poll on what it is people believe, but to talk about why we believe it, because that's where the real value is.

 

[Valerie]

For the record, I said justify, not discuss