Goths

Velvet Creation said:
I totally agree with you. What you said complements what I said about Goth not being mainstream. Like you said, there is this mix between goth/rock and goth/electro, but I assure and I think you agree that this kind of music/people certainly are not the same kind of "goth" we see at Hot Topic. :)

Remember kids, HIM (they try hard though), Korn, Slipknot... are not Goth.
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:D
 
Einojuhani Rautavaara, a Finnish composer, said, "If an artist is not a Modernist when he is young, he has no heart. And if he is a Modernist when he is old, he has no brain." This can be applied to rebellion/non-conformity. These young, self-proclaimed "Non-conformists," that listen to HIM, Slipknot, etc, are posers, not goths. I'm not very old (20, 21 in two weeks) but I'm not a little teenager. I have no reason to not conform or rebell against anything. These kids just want to look different, and like someone else said, do it for the sake of doing it. I like the style, but the exact type of clothes that I wear, I never see these teens ever wearing. I like the victorian style dresses, and just normal skirts, and when I'm lazy, band shirts :) (I love my Opeth, Dark Funeral and Agothodaimon shirts :))
I never wear any fishnet or PVC shit, it looks rediculous in my opinion. I'm just a normal person, not depressed or suicidal, wearing the attire that I like, not the costume I want to rebell with ;) Plus I listen to real metal (Opeth, Tristania, Dark Tranquillity, Carcass etc) and on occasion Goth/Death rock (Specimen, Voodoo Church, Christian Death etc)

I suppose that's the difference from poser.
 
My POV on this topic:

"Goth" is a mindset and a way of life related to art, music, politics.

Visually, it is silent and passive non-conformism, not aggressive non-conformism.

These idiots with piercings and pink stockings are posers, they are not goth.

"True" goths are intelligent, creative, emotionally dark but passionate, and do not always wear black. They are usually healthy, not obsessed with drugs (because to do so would be a form of conformism itself), and do not go out of their way to proclaim their anti-conformism to the world. It's more personal than that, but not hidden.

Real goth is done with subtlty, intelligence and not through aggressive displays of studs, piercings, PVC and leather. It is not a proclaimation for superiority in any way. It is appreciation for emotional beauty in darkness.

What we see these days is more so "mall goth", which is not related to the above.
 
The Hubster said:
They are usually healthy, not obsessed with drugs (because to do so would be a form of conformism itself)
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This is not always true, though. Some see drugs as a form of self-discovery or as a way to connect with/on other levels of conciousness. These aren't my views, but they have been in the past.[/quote]

Real goth is done with subtlty, intelligence and not through aggressive displays of studs, piercings, PVC and leather. It is not a proclaimation for superiority in any way. It is appreciation for emotional beauty in darkness.
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Yes, I hate the gasmasks and pvc and such bullshit associated with goth club scenes. These aren't goths...these are "rivetheads" or more accurately, in my opinion, "ravers" (because that's all they really are).

Flaming Death said:
I didnt really want to read anymore but I wanted to respond and say the Cure is awesome and particularly "Pornography"
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Seventeen Seconds is as good or better, and Faith is pretty gloomtastic as well. Disintegration is great too, but it's much lusher and not as minimalist. [/fanboi]
 
This is a pretty interesting thread I didnt know so many metal folks
liked the Cure and Bauhaus and so forth. Yes I mean other than metal
and punk industrial/goth music is constantly being played at my home.
Frontline Assembly had some killer music esp. Milliniem which featured
Devin Townsend on guitar of all people.
 
Here is the reason why I love to hate those loosely termed as "Goths"...

Modern "Goth" culture, as practiced by confused, insecure teenagers, has little to do with it's origins. I'm sure most of you know (because all metalheads are huge nerds) the historical origins of the term gothic, and that at that stage it had a lot less to do with wearing black than it does these days.

"Goth" became associated with dressing in black after the modern resurrection of the term was branded on bands such as Joy Division etc. and moreso as the anti-disco culture was born. Wearing bright colours meant you were probably into disco so a lot of people started wearing black to stand appart (can you really blame them).

In conclusion... today's "Goths" are arsebags because while popular music still wears more colour than the gay flag, so has "wearing black and being hardcore" become popular... and the point is lost.

I really do hate most goths, but only because I hate most teenagers, depressives and fat people.

Btw. This is a great thread.
 
KMADD said:
Agreed real goths don't even go around in public looking like HIM in the
sunlight. And I have to add Frontline Assembly, Die Krupps, The Electric
Hellfire Club, Kevorkian Death Cycle and Wumpscut among many others
to the mix. Shit on EHC's last album there were a few black metal and death metal
musicians collaborating with them on that cd. The goths I know in my
community frown on those kids but what can you say there kids give it
a rest.
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EHC is awesome:D
 
Yes there were Goths and Visigoths hundreds of years ago. My middle name is actually taken from one of their kings.
But they weren't like the stupid moany twats calling themselves Goths these days. "Oh woe is me, everyone is stupid and I'm so hyper-intelligent. I hate everyone, so I'll just slash myself. Woe is me. Think I'll listen to Marilyn Manson, his music always makes me feel even more suicidal".
*puts on "The Nobodies". Cries while looking in the mirror dramatically*
 
Well thoes are the popular brand of goths as I would say. I used to hang with a bunch of Japanese foreign exchange students and they were all goth. But different in that they were closer to metalheads. They wernt whiney about conformists or self pain, they just thought the darker aspects of things were cooler, actually had a sence of humor (no matter how morbid it was it still counted) and studied a lot of ocult things like pagan and whicca. They still dressed in the steriotyipical goth atire but with more consideration to it. they would come to school with like top and bowler hats on and old handmade victorean clothes that looked preaty kick ass. That is what i see an real goth, not this western in-denial emo that you see here.
 
I only know one Goth and she liked to cut herself. I never realised they were ALL into it, I just thought she was a bit fucked up. Apparently it's all the rage with the discerning Goth these days.
Idiots.
 
Stormwatch said:
I only know one Goth and she liked to cut herself. I never realised they were ALL into it, I just thought she was a bit fucked up. Apparently it's all the rage with the discerning Goth these days.
Idiots.
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Hahah, umm, I think it's more of a teenage girl problem than a "goth" problem, though I'm sure that exacerbates the situation, since girls are basically taught to hate themselves these days.
 
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