Laeth MacLaurie said:
hmm, "faggot" and "jew" in the same sentence. i suppose that is the benefit of a classical education.
Music: The Most Intellectually Demanding Artform?
- Thread starter Laeth MacLaurie
- Start date
hmm, "faggot" and "jew" in the same sentence. i suppose that is the benefit of a classical education.
Actually, they're in consecutive sentences, not the same sentence. I suppose that being completely unaware of grammar rules is one of the benefits of being completely ignorant.
Frostangelstorm
Mighty Ravendark
Saying that Literature takes less intelect than music is pretty much described like "all authors speak in one language", while each composer speaks in his. It's somewhat true, but then again it somewhat isn't, as the same could be if I said that "all composers use the same notes anyway". What isolates music from other forms of art, though, is the emotion and things that can't be expressed in text, painting, etc. as clearly.
I may be missing the point completely, but English is only my third, so this is what I think.
I may be missing the point completely, but English is only my third, so this is what I think.
Stormwatch
Cock.
Erik said:
Fuck off, WASP turned to shit after Headless Children.
This thread is nonsense. WTF is challenging about listening to music? SIt down, turn on stereo, listen. Do I like it? Do I not? Hmm, what a hard question, I must do a 45 page dissertation on the relative merits of "Slippery When Wet".
Sinister Mephisto
1337
- Sep 20, 2005
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Erik said:
Oh for fucks sake at least make it
short answer: yes
long answer: definitely
or something.
Cynical said:
haha give me a fucking break, man. you and he both know what i'm talking about. consecutive sentences, sure...you got me. does that lessen the scope of it, though? not at all. he's as ignorant of human relations as i am to grammar rules, i suppose.
Music that is meaningless, boring, and detached is "nonsense". Music is an expression of emotion, political opinion, or whatever is on one's mind. Music is art and art is an expression. If you don't find your music challenging or interesting than why listen to it? If you're not getting anything out of it than what's the point? Instead of being a dick think about it.Stormwatch said:
One thing i get tired of hearing about is how people criticise metal because of the vocals. What they don't think about is the fact that metal, like all art, has different ways of expressing the message, in our case the lyrics. We choose to use growls or screams to get that across. I can't imagine trying to R&B vocalize the lyrics used in metal. It just doesn't work.
Neurotic
New Millenium Christ
well literature uses a language just like music uses a language.
either you like it or not (we had this discussion before) every composer uses the same language, music theory.
now the way you use it gives your originality, that "language" each composer has, that you talk about.
but in literature or in another art, the way you use the tools you possess is what makes you original or not, or have your own "language".
some book autors have their own way of writing senteces, their own "rhythm", peculiar use of punctuation, large descriptions , symbolisms etc; just like composers use music theory to achieve the emotions they want in a particular piece.
actually a film, a book, a picture can be as demanding as music.
i think anybody that listens to a piece constantly, as demanding as it may be, the more they listen the more they will start to understand it and grow on them. most people just dont make the efford and don't care and want instant gratification.
and music is based on the real world, sound is everywhere, you can hear rhythms in sounds everywhere, the sound of train, a bird "singing", the whispering of the wind, a storm, animals etc.
maybe thats why we like people growling and screaming like pigs lol.
either you like it or not (we had this discussion before) every composer uses the same language, music theory.
now the way you use it gives your originality, that "language" each composer has, that you talk about.
but in literature or in another art, the way you use the tools you possess is what makes you original or not, or have your own "language".
some book autors have their own way of writing senteces, their own "rhythm", peculiar use of punctuation, large descriptions , symbolisms etc; just like composers use music theory to achieve the emotions they want in a particular piece.
actually a film, a book, a picture can be as demanding as music.
i think anybody that listens to a piece constantly, as demanding as it may be, the more they listen the more they will start to understand it and grow on them. most people just dont make the efford and don't care and want instant gratification.
and music is based on the real world, sound is everywhere, you can hear rhythms in sounds everywhere, the sound of train, a bird "singing", the whispering of the wind, a storm, animals etc.
maybe thats why we like people growling and screaming like pigs lol.
Demilich
Remember
Sinister Mephisto said:
but then you lose the whole "OMG CAN YOU BELIEVE HE MADE THE LONG ANSWER AS SHORT AS THE SHORT ANSWER!!!" aspect of it
why would you want to do that?
byrne
Certavi et vici
I thought that the musical aspects of music were just "window dressing"? Does that not just make music a form of literature/poetry - in it's meaningful form of expression at least? Therefore, according to your argument, how could it possibly be any more intellectually demanding than a book or poem?
Demilich
Remember
Laeth MacLaurie said:
This post, and this user in general, are goldmines of large leaps in reasoning. First of all, how does the fact that most of those who have experienced the greatest degree of success in a field define the entire scope of the field? Correct me if I'm wrong, but philosophy is simply a symbolic (linguistic) representation of an abstract discipline and body of thought, theory, etc. An incidental trend towards anti-Semitism in the mainstream realm of philosophy DOES NOT in any way tie the discipline down to that way of thinking. Fuck that. And I'm pretty sure a few of the "intelligent" people out there know how fucking ignorant it is to erroneously attribute things you don't like about a group of people to their ethnicity.
The reason that music would be more challenging is because of how layered it is. Analyzing music means looking into multiple instruments and the lyrics along with the vocal melody. Literature involves the words only. Paintings involve the image only. Music involves multiple art forms making it slightly more difficult to swollow. Unless of course you're listening to metalcore.
Susperia
Member
Demilich
Remember
What I don't agree with is the "layering" and the concept of music as more of a personal language than the written word. I don't know shit about painting, but saying it usually depicts reality is just not true. Abstract visual art can be pretty layered/subtle in it's symbology also. And with written word, the language may be standardized but many authors have highly unique, personal and identifiable ways of constructing words to create symbols that go beyond most common uses of language in daily conversation.
TylerTheNuke
I have eaten you
Laerthe may come across as a douche, but his threads do end up being the most interesting. As for music being the most intellectually challenging, I say that it is not necessarily true. From a creator's point of view, it is all equally hard to make. However, as an observer, it is usually the music and literature that is the most challenging, for the reasons you said. It is very possible for a drawing to be intellectually challenging. As with any medium, there is use of subtlety and symbolism. It is wholly possible to draw a picture as an allegory of something, although I can't think of any examples. As for this jew bashing, let me say something. My favorite teacher is a hyper intellegent physics teacher. He went to MIT. He knows more history then any of my history teacher's. He knows more chemistry then my chemistry teacher. He has tons of life experiance. He was involved in a protest that became a police beating. He taught in the poorest school in the nation (100% black, incidentally). He stayed in africa and was friends with coffee farmers (who can make less then 1$ a day), ect. He returned with handmade drums and sold them on ebay for a lot of money and gave all of the profits to the people who made them in africa. He designed and built a straw bale house (effective insulation and good for environment) by himself. He invented a new type of solar panel. He is a great guy. And guess what? He's jewish. I wonder how many jewish people you know personally. My guess is that you form your opinion of them solely from what people say about them. Stop being an ethnical deuche. There is no scientific basis for one race being superior to another, although by some measures like average IQ the white race is actually inferior. Shut up and stick to talking about music, please.
Neurotic
New Millenium Christ
Demilich said:
exactly.
and i agree, he knows how to do good threats lol controversy is always good.
TylerTheNuke said:
Good point there on that all serious art forms are not easy to make for the creator. All serious art forms have idealogies behind it but you can still "get" the work somewhat even if you are not able to explain it. Images can be experienced in an instant as sensation in comparison to literature and music when you need time to digest it. I guess what Laeth is trying to say here is that music plays a role like painting and literature in the same time therefore very subtle.
Susperia
Member
Stormwatch
Cock.
WASP can still do good songs, but the production after Headless has ruined every album (apart from KFD which I rather like).
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