Satanism and Metal

NocturnalSun said:
these are by far your stupidest statements. the 'temptations' are worthless and are only meant for temporary false happiness. What will you do when your life is over? where will you go and what happened to all your earthly pleasures? could it be that they are only... temporary? only existing on the human plane? these earthly desires and pleasures are worthless and pointless and created by HUMANS who have the ability to erre, and obviously have done so at some point in history. you need to start looking indepth to what you are being spoonfed like a baby from these bands and from whoever's telling you all this bullshit.

well, I've tried to give you insight... take it or leave it. you can diss/bash me however you see fit, as I know a good 95% of you are highly opinionated.

Agreed that we are Temporary and all our Temptations are worthless, but i am a totally Practical person, I take life by the day and i believe that if one doesnt satisfy their own needs ( which doesnt cause harm to others ) then this life is not worth living for. At the same time i too feel sometime why are we always in the rat race for all these Desires and Temptations when ultimately all are bound to endup as Dust and Bones, its a constant war of thoughts u know, both pros and cons, sometime i feel Animals are way better
than Humans, atleast they achieve what they want with guts and grace, be it killing or deciet, not like we worthless humans who are born to pretend , backstab and defy others, May be i shud call myself as a Misanthrope instead of an Atheist, coz i don give a shit abt the so called God or Satan or Whatever higher power , bottomline is Humans are a disease or more precisely Virus !!! :yell:
 
On a slightly lighter hearted note my I suggest that we put religion and the laws of the universe on ice and get down to some serious Megadeth!
 
Anonymousnick, you are the one being ignorant. Regarding one of your earlier posts on or around page 8.

If you read up about your "prophet" muhammad, you would see he married a 9 year old girl, so that would make him a peadophile. If you don't believe me look it up, you can't expect muslims to be non-biased. I have also read that muhammad was a war mongerer, who killed people for refusing to convert to islam.

I am not trying to offend you but you should look for the truth.

Halal/kosher meat is also barbaric in my opinion.

I know some muslims who don't even listen to music as this is supposedly against the teachings of islam? Is this true, and if so aren't you contradicting the religion you seem to love so much?

On the satanist/metal issue, I don't care, and when I'm feeling pissed off, I actually love listening to bands with an anti-religous theme. All those that have a problem with it shouldn't listen to it.

In my opinion religion is just a tool to control the masses, and numerous contradictions have been found in so called "holy books".
 
I think there's an infinite difference between raw religion and organised religion. Organised religion is gernerally what so many people have a problem with - me included, to a certain extent. A glance at the history of the European church would seem to confirm that politics, wealth, control and power were just as prominent motives as the ibvious religious ones.

I feel that there is nothing wrong with churches either - they provide a place where people with like beliefs can worship. It is the connection to the larger web of organisation that I object to.

People should try to dinf their own faith, and their own path in life, and I feel I can still have Christian beliefs while doing that. A lot of the so-called laws and ways of the church were simply brainchild's of human figures. Beore Pope Gregory I for example, priests could marry at will, which would seem a lot better, in the eyes of God apart from anything else.
 
Celibacy has become a big issue, you're right, and not even I agree with it. It was instituted by a human, after all, so that is not the fault of the church in any way. They felt that for some humans, it would be safer avoiding the stresses of marriage and devoting oneself wholly to the worship of God.

Chaos23: you are far behind, have you even looked at any of what I'v been saying? If you have you could have drawn somewhat of a conclusion that the organized 'church' is a hell of a lot different than the real thing. That's why us Christians are so hated, I've come to learn. Christian-bashers make generalized statements about what they know as the 'Christian church' (being the televangelists, the hypocrites, and what not) and do not bother to delve into theology to actually make sure what they're saying got interpreted in the right fashion. One religion should not be blamed wholly for the faults of several of its hypocritical followers.

And also, religion is hardly mind control for the masses as you make it out to be. It is a valid and working way to find out more about the history of existence. Once you get past the stereotypes and generalizations you may have about religion, you can actually see religion for what it really is, but until you toss those out, more likely than not you're going to view religion in a bad light as you do now. I strongly advise you to change your thinking to at least understand religion and tolerate those around you who practice it, as we are all human and must live on this world together, so why not make the best of it.

Also, on the issue of the music being against religious teaching, I know it is Islam you are talking about, but it is in no religion's teachings that music with anti-religious themes/lyrics to it is BAD or contradictory. It is whether YOU personally take in those beliefs and make them your own and support them that makes such things BAD or contradictory. The music in and of itself is in no way, shape, or form conflicting with religion in anyway. I, for one, listen to Black Metal and Death Metal a ton because it interests me and it is another form of "Music", so why not? I listen to all types of music. I can listen to Dani Filth chanting the Satanic Mantra and still not be affected one bit. Have I sinned from listening to the music? hell no, because I don't hold those beliefs.

Clangorous: I was stating all those things previously and 'taking it personal' because you were bashing Christianity unfairly. You also seem a bit confused about your religion, as you ended your post with something to the tune of 'Now is the time for SATAN!' while claiming to be Hindu which (correct me if I'm wrong) constitutes hypocritical thinking. And actually, religions CAN agree that there might be something other than their God. You can CALL it whatever name you want, but as long as you believe that there in fact IS a higher power which gave life, then we can agree. I am a Christian in general, but some of my thinking is not wholly Christian, I guess you would say. I call the being 'God' and believe that his son, 'Jesus', was the enfleshment of God, so I am actually Catholic. also, Catholicism/Christianity do not FORCE others to convert if they are unwilling to. This is another generality that is constantly applied to Christians.

On holy wars, you may be ridiculing all religion, but guess what buddy. THE WARS WERE OVER WAAAAY BACK! Don't hold that crap against us because it doesn't apply anymore, we are not responsible for what our ancestors did even though we have to suffer through everyone's constant remembrance of it and ridiculing by people who believe it still does apply.

On the concept of animals living better lives than humans, I totally disagree. Animals have very tiny brains and can hardly think outside of the box. The box being the need to provide for itself and its own needs. We humans have a much larger brain and are intelligent enough to know that only thinking about one's own worries isn't helping anyone else. I know Christianity teaches that we are put on this earth for many reasons, one of them specifically being to help and aid others, as we all share a common trait. We are HUMANS, as different as we may be and we should help others in whatever way we can. You end your arguments by stating that you indeed do not give a shit about a higher power and even went as far as calling yourself atheist/misanthrope. You REALLY need to figure out WHAT you are because you've just went through 4 religion changes in less than a week.

In closing, if anyone finds me to be annoying or bothersome because of my 'sickeningly good-natured heart' then congratulations, you've just experienced the driving force behind all the hate that is thrown at Christians. Most of the time, halfbrained people go against Christianity simply because they can't stand the air of positivity (is that a word btw?) surrounding most Christians. They can't get past their hangup of such a person being so nice and thus end up wanting to rebel against whatever is the driving force behind such happiness in hopes of breaking the happiness. I'm not saying YOU are a halfbrain for feeling the hate, but the general public who do so normally are, so that's why I said it.

(to everyone reading this) Have ny more questions about religion? If you do, go to a fucking theology class and LEARN (I didn't say convert, did I? NO. just LEARN). It might just bring you the answers you are looking for, as I of course have only probably 5% of the answers to your questions and such, even after a good solid 10 years of theology and religious knowledge. I'm sick and fucking tired of trying to explain and defend religion while in turn getting no good results from it on here. But, I am one of the few Christians you'll find outside of a classroom who, while NOT using the words "Fuck off and burn in hell, because I surely won't see you in heaven!", actually will take the time to explain why they believe what they believe in depth to a group of non-believers.
 
NocturnalSun, you gotta chill. I'm sure you feel very strongly about your religion as does Clangorous. What you learm in theology classes or in SUnday school, or Islamic School or whatever religious school is people's own interpretetions and opinions on the war. Nothing is fact really because you weren't there to experience, you only just got the geist of what really happened. Wars due to religion are just stupid, people should stop being greedy in terms of power, stop hurting people.

We only got a few years to live so make full use of it, stop ridiculing people. :) Either way, NocturnalSun I replied to the private msg you sent me. Chill out dude, everyone is ignorant and stubborn and we all get fed propaganda since we're young so what you may have learnt may differ from what other people might've learnt.
 
Chaos23 said:
Anonymousnick, you are the one being ignorant. Regarding one of your earlier posts on or around page 8.

If you read up about your "prophet" muhammad, you would see he married a 9 year old girl, so that would make him a peadophile. If you don't believe me look it up, you can't expect muslims to be non-biased. I have also read that muhammad was a war mongerer, who killed people for refusing to convert to islam.

I am not trying to offend you but you should look for the truth.

Halal/kosher meat is also barbaric in my opinion.

I know some muslims who don't even listen to music as this is supposedly against the teachings of islam? Is this true, and if so aren't you contradicting the religion you seem to love so much?
Unfortunately, you have offended me greatly. Ask any Muslim walking down the street if what you said is true. You'll find expressions of horror and disbelief on thir faces as they slowly back away until they bump into a pay phone and call for you to be taken away.

I doubt that they are ignorant.

What you say is false bullshit. Sorry, buddy.

And it's quite hilarious that you find halal/kosher meat barbaric. Perhaps you enjoy eating raw meat? Or how about swallowing animals whole while they're still alive, eh?

Chaos23 said:
I know some muslims who don't even listen to music as this is supposedly against the teachings of islam? Is this true, and if so aren't you contradicting the religion you seem to love so much?
The Muslims you know are obviously confused. Either that, or they fall into an Islamic denomination I am unfamiliar with.

Perhaps you are severly misinformed, and not an idiot. I'll go with that, giving you the benefit of the doubt. But don't you ever go attacking someone's faith without proper knowledge of it first. I don't mean to be a prick, but your comments make me uncoimfortable due to the personal bond every Muslim feels with the Prophet. By making such accusing statements, you've basically pissed on my face.

Speed made a comment about hallucinations before that I'd like to forget...but you are way out of line, partner.
 
I am actually a vegeterian. Halal/kosher meat is barbaric in that the animals throat is cut and bled to death. Quite humane innit?

Actually muhammad did marry a 9 year old girl, called aisha or something look it up for yourself if you wanna find out the truth about your religion.

Muhammad did start war on non-muslims. Forced conversion is a trademark of the muslims.

I am not an idiot or misinformed, I actually research, so I can make up my own mind on stuff without being brainwashed.

The muslim people I know can't listen to music as they state that "they are not allowed to allow thier mind to drift away from God or "Allah".

islam also promotes bigamy and double standards. Women have to cover up whilst men can do whatever they wish.

I don't mind religous people who don't enforce their belief onto others, but some act all righteous, that "their religion cannot be questioned".
 
Nocturnalsun, i wasn't referring to open-minded people like yourself you don't mind listening to anti-religous or "satanic" music (even if it does contradict your beliefs), I was referring to the whingers who were complaning about satanic themes.
 
NocturnalSun said:
Clangorous: I was stating all those things previously and 'taking it personal' because you were bashing Christianity unfairly. You also seem a bit confused about your religion, as you ended your post with something to the tune of 'Now is the time for SATAN!' while claiming to be Hindu which (correct me if I'm wrong) constitutes hypocritical thinking. And actually, religions CAN agree that there might be something other than their God. You can CALL it whatever name you want, but as long as you believe that there in fact IS a higher power which gave life, then we can agree. I am a Christian in general, but some of my thinking is not wholly Christian, I guess you would say. I call the being 'God' and believe that his son, 'Jesus', was the enfleshment of God, so I am actually Catholic. also, Catholicism/Christianity do not FORCE others to convert if they are unwilling to. This is another generality that is constantly applied to Christians.


Dude , Again u got me wrong, i never say anything specific to a Religion( like yours ), i always generalise (against all Religions). And abt the Statement abt Satan , i clearly mentioned in the post that if there is a God , I will take the side of Satan (i mentioned Satan just as an example for being opposite to God), And coming to my Religion stuff ( yeah u are right i'm SUPPOSED to be a Hindu), In my first post itself i mentioned "SUPPOSED" to be which means i don consider myself in to any Organised Religion. So there is no room for Hypocrisy. Mind you In our so called Religion there are around 30 million Gods and equal amount of Evils or Demons. So if i keep thinking of all these things , I will go nuts for sure o_O . I agree u might consider God as one , but tell me How many people are like you ???, not even 1%.(For ex : Consider in this Thread itself anonymous is defending Islam and u christianity) And about the conversions i was speaking about the things happening in my country, I am sure it does happen in other places also, You can't totally deny that Conversions doesnt happen. I know people who were forced to convert, they were totally brainwashed abt Christianity (mind you again this is not against u or christianity),i used that example coz ppl i know have gone thro that, I am sure its there in all organized Religions. On a final note i have nothing against believers, My policy is Live and Let Live, As a matter of fact All in my family are Theists excluding me and most of my frens also, I never ridicule them seriously, may be i might pull their leg once in a while by asking questions for whatever they do or follow, but i NEVER ridicule any Religion , Believe it or not
when i was a Theist i used to go to all places of Worship including Church and
Mosques. So to sum it up don take my statements personally, coz i am against all organised religions including the So called mine !!!.
 
xxchaotic, you gotta realize I have been taking theology lessons, not Catholic lessons or Christian lessons, I have been studying the actual HISTORY of our doings and where things originated and how things happened. If you bothered to get the message of my posts at all, you could easily see that I am not one of the 'righteous radicals' who think that 'my religion cannot be questioned'.

The only part where I sounded remotely like that was where I told you that there is no questioning the fact that a higher power/entity/being was the cause of existence. Life cannot just EXIST, it HAD to be created at some point, disproving the scientific theory and throwing out all validity of "Energy cannot be created nor destroyed." There had to have been someone, something, some entity, soe being, some tangible or intangible THING.
 
NocturnalSun said:
On holy wars, you may be ridiculing all religion, but guess what buddy. THE WARS WERE OVER WAAAAY BACK! Don't hold that crap against us because it doesn't apply anymore, we are not responsible for what our ancestors did even though we have to suffer through everyone's constant remembrance of it and ridiculing by people who believe it still does apply.

I don think so War are over , so whats happening between Israelians and Palestinians, or be it between India and Pakistan, or u can say between the USA and the middle east, they qualify as Holy War, Whatever done in the name of God or Religion is considered Holy War for me, and again i am not holding the concept against only Christianity, Dude agreed u r a Christian and u have good knowledge abt it, but always think in a broader perspective, never feel that all are cornering you. As far as me i will always be against any
Organised Religion Killing In the Name of GOD !!! :hotjump:
 
NocturnalSun said:
On the concept of animals living better lives than humans, I totally disagree. Animals have very tiny brains and can hardly think outside of the box. The box being the need to provide for itself and its own needs. We humans have a much larger brain and are intelligent enough to know that only thinking about one's own worries isn't helping anyone else. I know Christianity teaches that we are put on this earth for many reasons, one of them specifically being to help and aid others, as we all share a common trait. We are HUMANS, as different as we may be and we should help others in whatever way we can. You end your arguments by stating that you indeed do not give a shit about a higher power and even went as far as calling yourself atheist/misanthrope. You REALLY need to figure out WHAT you are because you've just went through 4 religion changes in less than a week.

Agreed Humans are more intelligent than Animals ,but as u know that intelligence is been used for more wrong things than right ones, Why mentioned that Animals were better because atleast they don live two faced lives, they do everything on the face without any pretensions, We as Humans, we call ourselves Socialised and Intelligent, but we end up being more barbaric than Animals, also we are selfish and selfcentred, Anything and everything we do has to have a Tag "How will it affect me ?", Face it Humans never do Selfless Good deeds, Take an example of a stray Dog , put a piece of bread, they will be so faithful, Do the same to a Human in need, once his stomach is filled, he will start thinking all kinds of other stuff to satisy his endless hunger and desires :erk: . I consider myself as an Atheist becoz i am not a believer in God or any Higher power and as a Misanthrope coz i hate the way Humans are always selfcentred.
 
NocturnalSun said:
xxchaotic, you gotta realize I have been taking theology lessons, not Catholic lessons or Christian lessons, I have been studying the actual HISTORY of our doings and where things originated and how things happened. If you bothered to get the message of my posts at all, you could easily see that I am not one of the 'righteous radicals' who think that 'my religion cannot be questioned'.

The only part where I sounded remotely like that was where I told you that there is no questioning the fact that a higher power/entity/being was the cause of existence. Life cannot just EXIST, it HAD to be created at some point, disproving the scientific theory and throwing out all validity of "Energy cannot be created nor destroyed." There had to have been someone, something, some entity, soe being, some tangible or intangible THING.

Dude how come you are posting early in the Morning ???, No school ??? :D
 
In relevance to Clangorous' post, if humans didn't arrogantly believe themselves to be more important than anything else, the world would be a better place.
 
NocturnalSun said:
xxchaotic, you gotta realize I have been taking theology lessons, not Catholic lessons or Christian lessons, I have been studying the actual HISTORY of our doings and where things originated and how things happened. If you bothered to get the message of my posts at all, you could easily see that I am not one of the 'righteous radicals' who think that 'my religion cannot be questioned'.

The only part where I sounded remotely like that was where I told you that there is no questioning the fact that a higher power/entity/being was the cause of existence. Life cannot just EXIST, it HAD to be created at some point, disproving the scientific theory and throwing out all validity of "Energy cannot be created nor destroyed." There had to have been someone, something, some entity, soe being, some tangible or intangible THING.

Hrmm, as much as the stuff you think you learn in school are facts, they're basically people's opinions and outlooks on things that have been handed down. That's what I choose to see in these so called "facts". I believe that there is no truth only human opinion. Theology lessons, Law lectures, Medicine classes...to me the lecturers or teachers are reading out of a book or talking right there, they are just saying stuff that's been written by another person's perspective. It's my outlook on life and no one can change that. Either way, it's cool that you took theology classes as I've said in our private msgs, I wouldn't mind taking it up either.

I'm still reading the Koran and my family is supposed to be muslim. As far as I know there are no rules against the listening of music. You probably have some fanaticist friends Chaos23. You're also probably reading some book cooked up by anti-muslims feeding their "I think Muhammad is a cunt" propaganda to you. Heh just kidding. I'm sure the book is only stating one sides opinion of history(as most books do). How come then Richard the Lionheart is known for his ruthlessness against the other religions in the crusades whilst Sultan Saladin treated even the Christians(the enemy?!) with respect during the 3rd crusades, even then both these historical figures had a friendship. As far as I've read, Muhammad was not a war monger but he did forcefully convert alot of people, but as far as I know alot of Christians forcefully converted people during the crusades with wars. I have yet to finish reading this book about the crusades so I may seem a little awry and vague.

Anyway, the conversation has gotten out of hand. I don't like organized religion, Islam, Christianity, Catholism(?), etc etc etc. Let us get back to the topic of satanism and metal. :)
 
I am a Christian myself, but I don't like traditional or organized religions. Believing and following Christ doesn't mean conforming to a church or obeying the bigots and preachers on TV. I do hate how people associate Catholics and the rest of us Christians as one big group. The Catholics started the Inquisition and persecuted people for heresy. Just remember, Protestant Christians were killed too for questioning the Catholic church. And whatever belief you hold, there will be extremists and fundamentalists, even if the belief is not really religious at all. It's unfair to judge someone based on what others of their faith have done. It's just like saying all metalheads worship Satan.

And for that last comment, I totally agree. But being a Christian doesn't mean you think you're better than anyone else. I certainly don't think I am, I've just accepted my flaws and trusted God to help me work on them and the rest of my life.
 
anonymousnick2001 said:
There are dozens upon dozens of books out there. Just be sure to get one written by an ACTUAL Muslim, preferably with a few degrees. You can usually figure it out by looking at the name.

I'm glad we agreed to disagree. That's the attitude most of my friends and I have so we can coexist with our faiths intact. I have so many Jewish and christian friends, as well as a few Buddhists, a few Hindus, and a Jain, if I'm not mistaken.

It's a shame that places such as Israel, India/Pakistan, and Ireland have so much conflict around them over something as intensely individualistic and private as religion. That's one of the things I enjoy about America.

Thats nice dude , you have all kinds of frens :worship: same with me i have frens from all religion, Where are u from Dude ???, Born and bought up in America ??? or elsewhere. I have the same views as yours abt Israel , India/Pakisthan, I am from India, I feel all these communal fights are cooked up for political motives, I have spoken to lot of ppl on chat who are from Pakisthan , they are pretty nice, now with India offering Medical assistance to pakisthanis, common citizens out there have a great deal of respect towards Indian Doctors :). I guess things are surely improving dude :Spin:
 
Chaos23 said:
I am actually a vegeterian. Halal/kosher meat is barbaric in that the animals throat is cut and bled to death. Quite humane innit?

Actually muhammad did marry a 9 year old girl, called aisha or something look it up for yourself if you wanna find out the truth about your religion.

Muhammad did start war on non-muslims. Forced conversion is a trademark of the muslims.

I am not an idiot or misinformed, I actually research, so I can make up my own mind on stuff without being brainwashed.

The muslim people I know can't listen to music as they state that "they are not allowed to allow thier mind to drift away from God or "Allah".

islam also promotes bigamy and double standards. Women have to cover up whilst men can do whatever they wish.

I don't mind religous people who don't enforce their belief onto others, but some act all righteous, that "their religion cannot be questioned".
Sorry, but your research was bullshit and your facts are false trash. Either that or generalizations. Horrible, racist generalizations.

I can understand your feeling of contempt for kosher meat being a vegetarian, but the procedure by which it is done ensures that the animal feels no pain.