Submission: Women of Islam

[genocide roach]

ok, some of you are too ignorant to discuss this. namely panzerkunt. surely there are problems in the middle east. but the culture as a whole arent like this. it varies country to country. some muslim countries, like qatar or the UAE, are quite progressive. billboards of mixed race families (white and arab. saw one the other day when i was in town), religious clothing are optional, etc.

i compare fundamentalist muslims to fundamentalist christians, especially bible belt america. anyone seen the movie hell house? some of those loons think the same way about rape. or how bout jesus camp where that fat bitch actually thinks that the radical muslims have a good idea in violence for religion and she is trying to raise a child army for the cause. its in no way a strictly muslim problem. its a problem that is suffered in all cultures.

suspirias intentions are honorable. things like female circumcision and stoning (of both genders) needs to stop. and in most places they have. just like lynching has stopped in most states in the US. for every 1 radical, there are 3 progressives.

i honestly think alot of muslims are apathetic to whats going on. they live their lives peacfully, and thats what they care about. they work, worship, and socialise like a normal person. at some point, the movement against radical islam will grow. its going to take time though.
~gR~

 

[Crimson Velvet]

All Panzerkunt said was that you should sort out your own issues (heaven knows there's quite enough of them) before trying to convert yet another country to your own standards, which is completely true.

Stop poking the bloody bee-hive already.

 

[genocide roach]

a western influence will NEVER stop what is going on in the islamic community. we shouldnt try to stop it. but what we should be doing is help create a safe enviroment for them to change on their own. it starts in western countries with large muslim populations, then move to more progressive countries like qatar (where there is a western influence and small population of brits), and then slowly to places like iran, somalia, and sudan.

the stage is already set for it, and the pieces are moving, but its going to take a long time. these ideals are deep rooted, but things are already starting to change.
~gR~

 

[hibernal_dream]

Why do they need to change? Because you think what they are doing is wrong? Based on what? Basically, if we are going to judge them, we have to judge them from our own perspective. There is no correct or neutral way to ascertain whether a culture is good or bad, or needs to change. There is only your point of view, and theirs.

 

[genocide roach]

they need to change because many in their culture want to change. there are plenty of muslims who want archaic practices to stop. but like i said before, many of them are apathetic to others suffering because they have a peacefull life. they feel ucky to have what they have. others also feel threatened, especially in a country like iran. but eventually, the tides will change. just like america changed. people will get tired of how their brothers/sisters are being treated eventually. but alot of them are still adapting to their new lifestyle.

its never a fast process and change will only happen when those who want it, really push for it. and it is happening.
~gR~

 

[Ben_t]

ok, some of you are too ignorant to discuss this. namely panzerkunt. surely there are problems in the middle east. but the culture as a whole arent like this. it varies country to country. some muslim countries, like qatar or the UAE, are quite progressive. billboards of mixed race families (white and arab. saw one the other day when i was in town), religious clothing are optional, etc.

i compare fundamentalist muslims to fundamentalist christians, especially bible belt america. anyone seen the movie hell house? some of those loons think the same way about rape. or how bout jesus camp where that fat bitch actually thinks that the radical muslims have a good idea in violence for religion and she is trying to raise a child army for the cause. its in no way a strictly muslim problem. its a problem that is suffered in all cultures.

suspirias intentions are honorable. things like female circumcision and stoning (of both genders) needs to stop. and in most places they have. just like lynching has stopped in most states in the US. for every 1 radical, there are 3 progressives.

i honestly think alot of muslims are apathetic to whats going on. they live their lives peacfully, and thats what they care about. they work, worship, and socialise like a normal person. at some point, the movement against radical islam will grow. its going to take time though.
~gR~

Actually I think that's called excision.

 

[Ben_t]

they need to change because many in their culture want to change. there are plenty of muslims who want archaic practices to stop. but like i said before, many of them are apathetic to others suffering because they have a peacefull life. they feel ucky to have what they have. others also feel threatened, especially in a country like iran. but eventually, the tides will change. just like america changed. people will get tired of how their brothers/sisters are being treated eventually. but alot of them are still adapting to their new lifestyle.

its never a fast process and change will only happen when those who want it, really push for it. and it is happening.
~gR~

This change has to come from them. You can't force cultural or religious changes on people. Things will change when they decide to change. It might be unfortunate for many of them but there's not much that can be done from an external perspective.

 

[genocide roach]

agreed
~gR~

 

[PanzerKunt]

ok, some of you are too ignorant to discuss this. namely panzerkunt.

Nice to meet you too.

 

[Susperia]

Why do they need to change? Because you think what they are doing is wrong? Based on what? Basically, if we are going to judge them, we have to judge them from our own perspective. There is no correct or neutral way to ascertain whether a culture is good or bad, or needs to change. There is only your point of view, and theirs.

THEY CUT OFF THEIR WIVES FINGERTIPS IF THEY DARE TO WEAR NAILPOLISH! THEY TREAT WOMEN LIKE ANIMALS! OR EVEN WORSE------DIRTY OBJECTS FOR SEX AND A SENSE OF "SAFETY". HOW DARE YOU EVEN TRY THAT POLITICALLY CORRECT PUSSY FUCKING BULL SHIT ON ME.

 

[Hell Awaits Us All]

THEY CUT OFF THEIR WIVES FINGERTIPS IF THEY DARE TO WEAR NAILPOLISH! THEY TREAT WOMEN LIKE ANIMALS! OR EVEN WORSE------DIRTY OBJECTS FOR SEX AND A SENSE OF "SAFETY". HOW DARE YOU EVEN TRY THAT POLITICALLY CORRECT PUSSY FUCKING BULL SHIT ON ME.

x2

LOL animals get treated much much better than women in Islam. Dogs here are treated with more respect and have more freedom than women in islam. Ofcourse some douchebags in here will always have the bullshit "oh it's their culture, let them do whatever they want" response. Fucking morons who are no better than the fundamentalists that run these governments.

 

[PanzerKunt]

Feel free to go to Somalia and save the world from cruelty Susperia, just remember not to see Black Hawk Down first. Things don't change over night, I probably know that better than most of you. Forcing people to change doesn't work.

 

[Susperia]

Who am I forcing?

---- I'm not as naive as you think. This is just a thread on a Metal messageboard, trying to raise a little awareness and/or keep these women in people's thoughts. I'm not superwoman nor do I pretend to be.

 

[PanzerKunt]

I was exaggerating on the forcing part.

And well, because 1: this isn't exactly news to anyone and 2: you're posting this on a metal message board which doesn't exactly reach out to a vast amount of individuals who all have different opinions on the subject of religion, you should have known that the responses would be somewhat close to what you got. Juzz sayinnn'

 

[Susperia]

I think the majority of responses here were positive. There were a few attempts by a few who will remain nameless trying to show off their "manliness", or whatever, with rude and unempathic responses but overall they weren't bad.

 

[PanzerKunt]

If you say so

 

[Susperia]

Or maybe this place has brought my standards down to an all time low.

 

[cookiecutter]

Why do they need to change? Because you think what they are doing is wrong? Based on what? Basically, if we are going to judge them, we have to judge them from our own perspective. There is no correct or neutral way to ascertain whether a culture is good or bad, or needs to change. There is only your point of view, and theirs.

This is bullshit. A culture is bad when they kill women for being raped or when they force women to wear a Burka. Those are not western values those are human values. Islamic law is sickening and what makes it worse is that it is based on something that is untrue. If some muslims ignore the bad parts of their religion, as genocide roach mentioned, that's great, but it obviously is practiced in many parts of the world.

 

[Hell Awaits Us All]

This is bullshit. A culture is bad when they kill women for being raped or when they force women to wear a Burka. Those are not western values those are human values. Islamic law is sickening and what makes it worse is that it is based on something that is untrue. If some muslims ignore the bad parts of their religion, as genocide roach mentioned, that's great, but it obviously is practiced in many parts of the world.

there are some absolute fucking morons on this board. To justify this sort of subhuman, barbaric and despicable behavior with the guise of cultural freedom is repulsive on every level imagineable. I don't give a shit about western "values", there should be some basic fucking human values that are universal (IE treat everybody with dignity would be one). I come from armenia which is an extremely traditional/conservative country. Women rarely work or drive unless they absolutely want to and still women are treated with an extremely high level of respect and dignity. They have almost all the rights as men do (though majority act as housewives). Although I wish my country would become more modern with its values, I don't have a problem with it because the women don't have a problem with it. They are treated very fairly on every level and if they wish to seek economic prosperity, they can do so (although that is still mostly unusual).

I suppose if a culture said it's ok to brutally torture and murder every woman who said no to a man's sexual advances, I am sure there would be still some imbeciles who could justify that.

Islam, your door to the horrors of the 13th century. (on second thought, some of this stuff is so unthinkably horrific, it makes the 13th century leaders look like progressives)

EDIT: I totally agree with CC, my post was more in response to everybody else than CC. I agree with cookiecutter on everything he said.

 

[unknown]

Dave, he was saying that Islam is wrong for those reasons (because of murdering, rape, etc...)...he was saying the respectful treatment of women is a human issue (not just a western issue)

edit: although he did word it kind of awkwardly, but whatever

edit 2: after reading dave's followup post, nevermind