The politics thread

The UN is impotent...they used to watch without doing anything when our soldiers were lynched by palestinians terrorsits, they did nothing during the war in yugoslavia in the 90's and they are sure as hell won't do anything now.

The UN's job is to maintain the status quo...not to stop things when they escalte
 
I know but what saying more, children are dying every day !
Your soldiers die on the battlefield as civilians under the bomb !

it's enough, I can't bear it anymore
 
paradoxile said:
The UN is impotent...they used to watch without doing anything when our soldiers were lynched by palestinians terrorsits, they did nothing during the war in yugoslavia in the 90's and they are sure as hell won't do anything now.

The UN's job is to maintain the status quo...not to stop things when they escalte

The UN will do whatever Israel and palestine want´s in this matter, yugoslavia was diff cos russia supported milosevich. Israel´s´foundation was a UN decision, and thus responsebility.
 
paradoxile said:
The UN is impotent...they used to watch without doing anything when our soldiers were lynched by palestinians terrorsits, they did nothing during the war in yugoslavia in the 90's and they are sure as hell won't do anything now.

The UN's job is to maintain the status quo...not to stop things when they escalte
not to mention they have less than neutral interests :(
 
paradoxile said:
plus the whole fake dead children for the media trick they pull every time...get some kids smear them in blood tell them to lie still on the street and get the camera crew to get the world to cry about the innocent children

My friend, it makes me sad to read such words. It makes me sad to see that violence is prevailing these days, and it is being met with more violence only to make it stronger.
Again, "No generalization is wholly true, not even this one"... you are saying that the pictures of dead children are fake. I don't know how you know this, or if you have personally seen their pictures being taken while they were actually alive. But I recall many live videos of children being shot dead while they were hiding with their parents. And as for the pictures coming from my country, I actually wish you were right about the children not really being dead, because unfortunately you are wrong, because I have seen them with my own eyes, because the fake pictures you are talking about are still in my mind as I write.
In a previous post, I posted a link to websites showing such pictures. Some of you said that others do not show such pictures in respect to the dead. We all respect the dead I assure you. But I believe that Israel does not show such things because it does not want to expose itself, does not want to shock its people by showing them that it is suffering such atrocities even if it is one of the strongest countries in the world. Same as the United States in Iraq, we rarely saw pictures of dead soldiers during the war.
Anyways this is not my point, Israel DOES NOT deserve to suffer because it has suffered for much too long, just like we have. But why do people here show such pictures? You may ask...well because us, the Lebanese citizens, the innocent dying ones, are WEAK, and we admit it. We are weak in front of such great Israeli military power, just as the Palestinian innocent citizens are weak...I am not talking about those amongst us who bear arms, but those who hide and flee, those who have seen enough blood, those whose parents, relatives and friends have died. These pictures are exposed because it is the only weapon we have as innocent unarmed people, because there is no balance of power, and because we do not want a war but we want all of this to stop. No more casualties, no more pain..for both the Lebanese, and the Israeli people.

paradoxile said:
now to nassrallah...he claims openly he has the right to abduct israeli soldiers on israeli soil and demand a 1000 of their people to be released from our prisons.people which have blood on their hands...and the arab people still blame israel for the war in lebanon

And it also makes me sad, that we are still pointing fingers, and that there is no more talk of peace or ceasefire. Sometimes I feel that I am in a dream, a bad dream and that at any moment I am going to wake up from it, and things will be back to normal.
I am not saying Hezbollah is not to blame, I am not saying Israel is guilt free. But the solution is NEVER in violence, and unfortunately with more than two milleniums of History filled with lessons to learn from, lessons that taught us that blood, violence and hatred are NOT the answer and they will never be.
I will never be afraid to say, and repeat that I want and hope for peace with the people of Israel, that I want them to come and see my beautifull country just as I want them to welcome me in theirs.
I believe just as many of you have said before me, that we should be talking about ways to solve this, rather than to point the blame and to justify the blood and the killings on both sides. I know that in the end violence, war, hatred cannot prevail, but we should not sit around and be sucked in to such matters...we should work against them.
Hope dies last.
And paradoxile, I hope you take no offense from any of this, I only quoted you because I felt what you said was related to what I wanted to say. I know you are as disconcerted of all of this as we all are.
be safe.
 
Dear Falconsprit,

Thank you for your rational thread. There is no any direct offence against anybody, you have just written the truth.

Recent days, noone wants to pronounce the word "peace" any more. What the people say is "fight against terrorism" or "revenge" actually.

And dear Rashmoron, if you'll shot whole apertment because of a terrorist who lives there, all the other people who could survive, or who has relatives in that aperment will turn into terrorists. Or at least, they will hate from the state of Israel.

Don't forget, what you get is what you seed.
 
Palestinians work on Israeli Israeli soil, palestinians use Israeli phone company and phone lines, they get some food supplies from us daily,they get electricity and water from us...we should cut all our help and let them rot in their own shit untill their politicians would be smart enough to use the money to build independent sources of electricity,food etc etc and help their poor families instead of blowing the money on explosives and terroristic measures while their people are starving

Pardoxile, you cannot expect to be democratic or you also cannot expect from a country to be rich which is under the occopation.

Israel has really very better conditions than rest of the middle eastern countries. That's right and you can also proud of it. During Nazi Germany, German people was also living in comfort when they have put Jews to working/death camps too. And the most of German people had no response to that situation, because they was not able to think clear because they were at the war.
 
HeathenPride said:
if you'll shot whole apertment because of a terrorist who lives there, all the other people who could survive, or who has relatives in that aperment will turn into terrorists. Or at least, they will hate from the state of Israel.
QUOTE]

there are lots of innocents people in the bombed aréas, I think Israel is right to fight the terrorist but killing 400 people for few terrorists, the Israeli force is not used very well, specific assaults on terrorists positions could be better for the Lebanese population!

I know my point of view is very simply for a conflict like that, but when I heard that Lebenese people who were not involved in Hezbollah join the terrorist movement because of the death of their relatives or the destruction of their house, I'm scared about the terrorists' retaliations on the Land Of Israel. That the circle of evil, an attack in Israel means after victims in Lebanon or Palestine and the same in the other way !
 
the biggest problem is - that you are all right!

Flaconspirit, i catually believe those photos are real....and believe me i shad a tear for each of those innocent children, who did nothing, and had to pay with their lives.....
but not only children.....you are a living proof for the other part of Lebanon that the israelis just don't know......the ones we can (and want) to make peace with!

HeathenPride....you are right as well.....i didn't protect the action of killing innocent people who are living in a houses, where the Hizbolla uses. the citizens have to do something, they have to know israel will go after the launches. but i feel sorry for them as well....i know they are just in the middle, and that's why they suffer the most.
 
One thing I'm kind of curious about, and I really hope this does not offend anyone or make it look like I'm taking a war lightly or anything like that, but does listening to Mayhem's Grand Decleration Of War send shivers down your spine when you are in an actual war? The first time I listened to that album, I felt this very strange and surreal effect. Does being in the middle of a war add to that since not only the theme of the album is about war, but the music has a very "war" like sound to it? I know it's a stupid question, but it was something I've been wondering about for a loooong time and the post before mine kind of reminded me of the album, so that's why I ask.
 
I didn't say anything about all the deaths of children are fake...but some are to show the horrible deeds of Israeli troops. matter of fact is the real dead and wounded children have been already picked to the hospital in Gaza or the morgue.
The whole occupation thing is bullshit...Israel has left the Gaza strip as a gesture of peace towards arabs and as I said before they attack us by shooting kassam rockets at sderot...everyone is saying about Israel we're occupants well we left Lebanon and left Gaza so in return they're being hostile towards us.

and I agree with Rashomon completely...we have nothing against Lebanon or its people and we regret of the loss of property and innocent lives in lebanon but again as I said before it's hizbollah that puts civillians in jeopardy when shooting rockets from civillian crowds and not allowing civillians to leave so they can have a human shield.

I saw the other day a civillian who lives in north beirut who said "I'm willing to give all of my kids(has 3 little children) for Nassrallah...and I say WTF? you're ready to secrifice your kids for a stranger's cause then don't cry later when Hizbollah hides in your building and Israel bombs it and killing all of your children.
 
u should leave the west bank as well. gaza is a tiny part and anyway the settlements should never have existed to begin with, they simply cant be justified.
 
Korlich said:
u should leave the west bank as well. gaza is a tiny part and anyway the settlements should never have existed to begin with, they simply cant be justified.

really funny...olmert was planning on leaving the west bank...if he leaves now the people of Israel will never forgive him.
first of all,all these territories were conquered in wars not started by Israel they belong to Israel...
secondly there are startegic points in the west bank which allow our safety...once we give those places to the palestinians will attack us from there as well on our major cities like Jerusalem,Bet Shemesh.
in 1967 after the 6 days war Jeruslam was finally united...palestinians want to have jerusalem as well...
don't you get it...nothing is going to setisfy them untill Isreal will become a small ghetto in the palestinian state...
look in the 70's Anuar Saadat and Menahem Begin signed a peace agreement between Egypt and Israel as part of this agreement we returned the whole sinai desert(which is twice the size of israel) to the egyptians after conquering it in the yom kipur war 1973(which we obviously weren't the ones who started it) and since then this peace agreement is lasting.
in 1994 Israel signed a peace agreement with Jordan we gave them some territories and since then we had good relations with Jordan...
in 1993 there was a peace agreement with the palestinians(in which chairman Arafat got the peace nobel prize) and from then untill now they have sent thousends of suicide bombers and kidnapped soldiers and shot at Israeli cars passing a road near an arab village, to israeli vilages knocking on the door on a staurday evening and when the door was opened they would shoot the father of the family and then entering and killing the rest of the family.
It's in reaction to these actions that our soldiers used force on palestinian territory not the other way around as the american media reported
they even used to shoot at our soldiers from behind UN posts and we accidently would hit a UN troop they would go to the media and say how agressive we are and how we kill UN officials.
so on this experience giving palestinians territories isn't going to help the peace here and isn't going to quiet them down furthermore it will make them closer to us which will allow them to shoot rockets at our big cities.
about hizbollah in the north it's the same thing...we left lebanon in 2000 and since then our north has flourished and so did lebanon but the fact is that Hizbollah was shooting rockets at our northern border cities once in a while completely unprovoked with us trying to negotiate with them unsuccefully to stop.
and now Nassrallah says that he'll stop shooting at the north if we give him the shabbah farms and release most of hizbollah and palestinian terrorist prisoners.

I was for giving gaza back to palestinians...we had nothing to do there and our civillians were at constant jeopardy and our soldiers died there day by day.
I honestly thought that us leaving gaza is going to quiet the palestinians...and I was proven wrong...I would rather live in an Israel half the size it is today if it was only safe and we had peace with our surrounding but the matter of fact is that they won't stop untill they get all the lands of Israel and that is unacceptable.
don't look at Israel as a majority against a palestinian minority here...look at it as a small jewish state in the middle of a huge muslim/arab empire streching from Marakesh to Bangladesh...that's the entire middle east and parts of the far east...and no one wants us(jews) to have even this small country
 
It would be great to have the opinion of the band on what's happening theses days in Lebanon, especially on the Kana slaughter which happened sunday morning (50 dead people, 22 "terrorist" children among them).

It would make the situation clearer for their fans in arabic countries (there might be a lot) and for their fans in western countries who don't support Israel's barbaric deeds.
 
Hello there.

In War Innocent people get hurt and die, it's hard for me to understand.
We are against killing, I don't believe the army was targeting civilians, and I am very sorry to hear that children were dying, it breaks my heart, doesn't matter id they are Israelis or Lebanease, they are children.

I don't believe the Israeli army has targeted to kill civilians, I know that the army askd from the Lebanease civilians to leave before they bomb, unlike Hizballah who is definitly pointing his weapon to civilians, and I am very sorry about what happend (not that my appologies will help the families that lost their children...)

I have a lot of friends in lebanon and I'm worried about them too, I hope an agreement will be found soon.

I pray that leaders, people will find the way to live in harmony, peace upon the Orphaned Land - Now!!
 
Thanks for these words of peace.

Take care all of you, I hope it's gonna stop soon.
 
paradoxile said:
really funny...olmert was planning on leaving the west bank...if he leaves now the people of Israel will never forgive him.
first of all,all these territories were conquered in wars not started by Israel they belong to Israel...
secondly there are startegic points in the west bank which allow our safety...once we give those places to the palestinians will attack us from there as well on our major cities like Jerusalem,Bet Shemesh.
in 1967 after the 6 days war Jeruslam was finally united...palestinians want to have jerusalem as well...
don't you get it...nothing is going to setisfy them untill Isreal will become a small ghetto in the palestinian state...
look in the 70's Anuar Saadat and Menahem Begin signed a peace agreement between Egypt and Israel as part of this agreement we returned the whole sinai desert(which is twice the size of israel) to the egyptians after conquering it in the yom kipur war 1973(which we obviously weren't the ones who started it) and since then this peace agreement is lasting.
in 1994 Israel signed a peace agreement with Jordan we gave them some territories and since then we had good relations with Jordan...
in 1993 there was a peace agreement with the palestinians(in which chairman Arafat got the peace nobel prize) and from then untill now they have sent thousends of suicide bombers and kidnapped soldiers and shot at Israeli cars passing a road near an arab village, to israeli vilages knocking on the door on a staurday evening and when the door was opened they would shoot the father of the family and then entering and killing the rest of the family.
It's in reaction to these actions that our soldiers used force on palestinian territory not the other way around as the american media reported
they even used to shoot at our soldiers from behind UN posts and we accidently would hit a UN troop they would go to the media and say how agressive we are and how we kill UN officials.
so on this experience giving palestinians territories isn't going to help the peace here and isn't going to quiet them down furthermore it will make them closer to us which will allow them to shoot rockets at our big cities.
about hizbollah in the north it's the same thing...we left lebanon in 2000 and since then our north has flourished and so did lebanon but the fact is that Hizbollah was shooting rockets at our northern border cities once in a while completely unprovoked with us trying to negotiate with them unsuccefully to stop.
and now Nassrallah says that he'll stop shooting at the north if we give him the shabbah farms and release most of hizbollah and palestinian terrorist prisoners.

I was for giving gaza back to palestinians...we had nothing to do there and our civillians were at constant jeopardy and our soldiers died there day by day.
I honestly thought that us leaving gaza is going to quiet the palestinians...and I was proven wrong...I would rather live in an Israel half the size it is today if it was only safe and we had peace with our surrounding but the matter of fact is that they won't stop untill they get all the lands of Israel and that is unacceptable.
don't look at Israel as a majority against a palestinian minority here...look at it as a small jewish state in the middle of a huge muslim/arab empire streching from Marakesh to Bangladesh...that's the entire middle east and parts of the far east...and no one wants us(jews) to have even this small country

what i here u say is terrorists decide whether u should have peace or not. That´s just sad. I know Israel was/is surounded by enemies (enemy goverments NOT ppl), but a two state solution is best bet to end this.