What the hell was Arch Enemy thinking???

[Ayeka]

Well, I must say, after hearing Arch Enemy for the first time at Donington, I went to their forum and shared my thoughts. Pretty much all the posts that followed mine expressed bewilderment at my description of them as "death pop". Sure, they may have a growly vocalist, but the music is pretty much mainstream...so it's kind of understandable when people say "sellout" when an extreme metal band only retains 'extremity' in vocals (and maybe a bit of fast drumming ).

I don't necessarily think this is a bad thing because I like my one Arch Enemy album. But other people might!

 

[J.]

Yeah, I saw this post in response to Lord hypnos, I believe.

Originally Posted by Diva Satanica
Right. We incorporated lots of synths and loops, I quit screaming and singing melodíc and poppy instead and besides, its all soft rock tunes on the album, no thrash and deathmetal in it at all. We will definitely be on heavy rotation on mtv for the next months, headline big theaters and sell 250.000 copies in the first week.

If I'm not mistaken, they are on MTV. Personally, i don't watch the channel, but apparently "We Will Rise" gets played. She sounds a bit defensive here, which doesn't paint her in a good light.

Have you ever fed your family with PERSEVERANCE? there are little kids attached to some in the band. Reality check. Why did the Soilwork drummer quit? He couldnt feed his family. Cuz when you are on tour 200 or more days a year, you cant have a regular job as well. Why did Johan quit Nonexist? Cuz he cant have a job and 2 bands (which are never touring, btw) at the same time.

Well boo fucking hoo. Cry me a river. I do feed my "family" on perseverance. I persevere everyday by going to work and bringing home the money.

perseverance - Steady persistence in adhering to a course of action, a belief, or a purpose; steadfastness

I didnt say we sold out.

Really? Then someone is lying.

I said we are aiming to gain more success, and more success is mainstream. It doesnt mean our music will turn into mainstream. It means, we are becoming a very seriously orientated band now who wants to reach all kinds of METAL fans. Broaden our fanbase within the METAL fans. Selling more METAL albums. Playing more METAL shows. Being able to make a living out of METAL. Like SLAYER. SLAYER. SLAYER.

Angela

Doesn't every band want to sell more albums? Play more metal shows? Sure they do, but not every band changes to appease an audience, and takes part in shoddy "sex sells" marketing.

 

[J.]

Sure, they may have a growly vocalist, but the music is pretty much mainstream...so it's kind of understandable when people say "sellout" when an extreme metal band only retains 'extremity' in vocals

Ding-dong. We have a winner.

 

[JayKeeley]

Well, I must say, after hearing Arch Enemy for the first time at Donington, I went to their forum and shared my thoughts. Pretty much all the posts that followed mine expressed bewilderment at my description of them as "death pop".

That's exactly what melo-death is. Remember that whole thread I started about people whining about power metal and no other genre? Well basically, take aggressive power metal and add death vocals, and you get 99% of what melo-death is all about.

Your description of Arch Enemy can be applied to ALL their albums. That's what everyone can't understand - people are going on as if Arch Enemy now sound like Bon Jovi.

 

[JayKeeley]

Sure they do, but not every band changes to appease an audience

But you're the only one on this thread that hasn't even heard the album!!

 

[NAD]

You're description of Arch Enemy can be applied to ALL their albums. That's what everyone can't understand - people are going on as if Arch Enemy now sound like Bon Jovi.

That was going to be my next question. I'm only familiary with Wages and Anthems, but if they have always used pop song structure, then the question of how exactly they sold out still remains.

I think my confusion is due to the fact that I find Anthems less mainstream oriented than Wages of Sin. It's still death-pop to a point, just less than it was.

 

[J.]

But you're the only one on this thread that hasn't even heard the album!!

Well, I did listen to some songs on the internet so I could stay up to speed with what everyone is talking about.

I did however listen to WoS many times and it struck me as bubble-gum metal for the masses. You know, the "safe" sounding metal.

....and you neglected to counter the rest of my post.

 

[JayKeeley]

I think my confusion is due to the fact that I find Anthems less mainstream oriented than Wages of Sin. It's still death-pop to a point, just less than it was.

AoR is much darker than WoS. A lot of that has to do with the production. Andy Sneap fucking brought out the bottom end, which Frederick Nordstrom normally rips out. That's why WoS sounds like it's coming out of your tweeters, just like all Nordstrom albums, and AoR sounds like it's hitting you in the gut.

 

[JayKeeley]

Well, I did listen to some songs on the internet so I could stay up to speed with what everyone is talking about.

Nope - not good enough. You have to have heard the album in its entirety to pass judgement. Likewise, I wouldn't ask you to review a movie after just watching the first 10 minutes.

I did however listen to WoS many times and it struck me as bubble-gum metal for the masses. You know, the "safe" sounding metal.

Yep sure it is, and AoR is slightly less so. I'm not sure how that is a criticism though?

....and you neglected to counter the rest of my post.

Been there, done it. Dream - the whole thread counters your post you mofo.

 

[bloodfiredeath]

I did however listen to WoS many times and it struck me as bubble-gum metal for the masses. You know, the "safe" sounding metal.

Yep sure it is, and AoR is slightly less so. I'm not sure how that is a criticism though?

Thus lies the fundamental difference in your arguments and why you should just agree to disagree.

By the way, I agree with Dreamlord in the sense that being bubble-gum metal for the masses is a bad thing.

 

[J.]

Thus lies the fundamental difference in your arguments and why you should just agree to disagree.

Fair enough.



And not to get the ball rolling again, but does it piss anyone else off that a lot of bands get softer and simpler as time goes on? Think about it, a miniscule amount of bands actually get angrier and more brutal with time. Just look at most of the bands with the bubble-gum melo-death scene. The Haunted is another one. Opeth. Carcass.

Actually trying to think of a band that got more brutal is a chore. I really wish bands would stick with what got them their fans in the first place.

 

[bloodfiredeath]

Actually trying to think of a band that got more brutal is a chore.

Testament immediately comes to mind, though that had a soft lapse in the middle, they are more brutal now than ever.

 

[Erik]

Shit, I was just going to say Testament. Not only did they get more brutal, they actually still play quality music. Who'd have thunk.

 

[NAD]

Slayer. Got Hates Us All is fucking insane.

Morbid Angel goes back and forth, but never loses intensity.

Opeth's heaviest album is Deliverance as far as I'm concerned.

Nile may be easier to listen to now, but is hardly soft.

 

[bloodfiredeath]

Shit, I was just going to say Testament. Not only did they get more brutal, they actually still play quality music. Who'd have thunk.

After shitting out two turds like Souls of Black and The Ritual, certainly not me.

 

[J.]

did Morbid Angel get harder after Domination? because Domination is known as one of the more "commercial" death metal albums

 

[J.]

Deliverance may be Opeth's most brutal, but it is also their most simple, barring Damnation.

 

[NAD]

Simple, yes. Better, yes. A case of less is more.

Domination commercial!!?? Who the fuck said that? Formulas Fatal to the Flesh was much more manic than Domination, Gateways is a little bit less so, and Heretic is somewhere between Domination and Formulas as far as insanity goes.

 

[J.]

Simple, yes. Better, yes. A case of less is more.

THat's the thing. Opeth were never about "simple". At least not on their earlier, better material.

Domination commercial!!?? Who the fuck said that? Formulas Fatal to the Flesh was much more manic than Domination, Gateways is a little bit less so, and Heretic is somewhere between Domination and Formulas as far as insanity goes.

I thought it was widely known. Magazines and zines say it. Terrorizer says it all the time.

 

[JayKeeley]

And not to get the ball rolling again, but does it piss anyone else off that a lot of bands get softer and simpler as time goes on? Think about it, a miniscule amount of bands actually get angrier and more brutal with time. Just look at most of the bands with the bubble-gum melo-death scene. The Haunted is another one. Opeth. Carcass.

Well, I think that for every band that decides to mellow out a bit, there must be a 100 new bands on the horizon ready to take the throne, so to speak. That's what makes metal never ending (and obviously so addictive) - we keep recycling our music, and the standout bands/albums are the ones that qualify as 'classic' and 'timeless'.

For me, I don't mind mixing it all up. I don't have a favorite genre either - at least, not anymore.