Life Sucks
and then you die
I agree. Some Christcore bands are decent, like Lengsel, but you really can't call it black metal.
Black Metal.
- Thread starter ROBL2500
- Start date
Manic Ferocity
Active Member
- Nov 5, 2006
- 5,280
- 559
- 113
why do people always call christan bands christcore. Whatever the music sounds like...then that is what the band is.
DarkBliss
...And okra for all
Because the genre's most devoted followers claim that a band's ideology is an inseparable part of the music and Christianity is a complete antithesis to everything that Black metal stands for. Take it up with Crimson Velvet and Hubster or just browse thisisaformictable's posts on the topic.
Manic Ferocity
Active Member
- Nov 5, 2006
- 5,280
- 559
- 113
Yes but that's only speaking for the ideologies. Christian themes might not make it tr00 kvlt black metal but it can still be black metal. Defining any genre should be based solely on the music.
Mort Divine
Shrine Maiden of the In-Crowd
Yeah, you're right there OI, but people don't see it that way with BM often - primarily because of the first wave.
It is all total bullshit but eh, what're ya gonna do.
It is all total bullshit but eh, what're ya gonna do.
V.V.V.V.V.
Houses Ov Mercury
I highly agree with OI, and have voiced that very same opinion many times, to no real avail. Beliefs will be beliefs.
V.V.V.V.V.
Houses Ov Mercury
Because people equate "core" with "trendy," which the same people see Christ in metal as.
The way I see it, Christ and Satan are two words for the same thing; bullshit.
The way I see it, Christ and Satan are two words for the same thing; bullshit.
Too fucking true. ;>
http://www.myspace.com/spiteextremewing
Everyone should listen to 'In Su La Vetta' as it's one of my favorite songs ever. ;o
skeptik
Member
- Feb 7, 2003
- 24,413
- 71
- 48
There are two separate definitions for 'Black Metal.' One is the bare minimum concept of having the musical aesthetic nature that falls in line with the generally accepted notion of what is aurally perceived as Black Metal. The proper definition of "Black Metal" as we understand it, however, takes Black Metal as an overarching conceptual basis that is not merely a style of playing. It's one thing to have the aesthetic components of something, and another thing entirely to actually be that something.
Re "unblack metal":
The music sounded like BM, but because of the lyrics and the spirit behind it, it is not BM.
Guess which black metal elitist said that? It was Jayson Sherlocke, aka Anonymous, the guy who founded Christian "black" metal. Too often you see the claim that it is the black metal artists and fans who reject the Christians, when in fact the Christians themselves often reject the label.
E: You chose "Holy Unblack" rather than "Holy Black". Do you feel that anti-Christian ideology was, at least originally, a fundamental element of black metal? Do you think it is possible for Christian metal to be truly 'black'?
A: I do NOT believe it is possible for Christian metal music to be truly 'black', no. I think it certainly helps the black metal cause if you 'hold to a Satanic ideology'. Black metal has changed and developed in both sound and lyrically over the years. Moving away from the simple 'Satanic' subject matter of it's early years, to the more poetic and story-like lyrics of today. But still, the dark, grim, horrific 'anti-God' themes remain, and this, coupled with the higher pitched shrill raspy vocals, the blast beats, and the unmistakable chainsaw guitar sounds all merge to create the BM sound. But it is the sound and the 'dark feeling' that truly defines what BM is, and the lyrics contribute to this. True BM I believe, is without light, void of hope, therefore Horde can never be classified as 'Holy Black'. Horde contains lyrics in opposition to darkness. In my opinion, 'Holy Black' cannot exist. Darkness disappears when light is present, the two cannot coexist. (source)
Why take two fundamentally opposed artistic movements and pretend they are all the same genre? Why gloss over the subtle nuances that make metal the genre that it is, full of depth and meaning, ideas and conflict? Much like it doesn't make sense to call a pro-G8 hardcore band anarcho-punk, or to call a spiritual pacifist who speaks out against drugs and promiscuity a gangster rapper, calling a Christian band black metal is simply a contradiction in terms in the name of convenience.
The music sounded like BM, but because of the lyrics and the spirit behind it, it is not BM.
Guess which black metal elitist said that? It was Jayson Sherlocke, aka Anonymous, the guy who founded Christian "black" metal. Too often you see the claim that it is the black metal artists and fans who reject the Christians, when in fact the Christians themselves often reject the label.
E: You chose "Holy Unblack" rather than "Holy Black". Do you feel that anti-Christian ideology was, at least originally, a fundamental element of black metal? Do you think it is possible for Christian metal to be truly 'black'?
A: I do NOT believe it is possible for Christian metal music to be truly 'black', no. I think it certainly helps the black metal cause if you 'hold to a Satanic ideology'. Black metal has changed and developed in both sound and lyrically over the years. Moving away from the simple 'Satanic' subject matter of it's early years, to the more poetic and story-like lyrics of today. But still, the dark, grim, horrific 'anti-God' themes remain, and this, coupled with the higher pitched shrill raspy vocals, the blast beats, and the unmistakable chainsaw guitar sounds all merge to create the BM sound. But it is the sound and the 'dark feeling' that truly defines what BM is, and the lyrics contribute to this. True BM I believe, is without light, void of hope, therefore Horde can never be classified as 'Holy Black'. Horde contains lyrics in opposition to darkness. In my opinion, 'Holy Black' cannot exist. Darkness disappears when light is present, the two cannot coexist. (source)
Why take two fundamentally opposed artistic movements and pretend they are all the same genre? Why gloss over the subtle nuances that make metal the genre that it is, full of depth and meaning, ideas and conflict? Much like it doesn't make sense to call a pro-G8 hardcore band anarcho-punk, or to call a spiritual pacifist who speaks out against drugs and promiscuity a gangster rapper, calling a Christian band black metal is simply a contradiction in terms in the name of convenience.
Mort Divine
Shrine Maiden of the In-Crowd
It isn't in the name of convenience it is in the name of "This is how it is."
Gangster rap is as much a musical style within rap as black metal is within metal.
Gangster rap is as much a musical style within rap as black metal is within metal.
Mort Divine
Shrine Maiden of the In-Crowd
Sure, it has an ideology that goes along with it typically - BUT without the music it is nothing, and the bands don't HAVE to follow that ideology to be black metal.
ohiogrinder
New Metal Member
- Mar 15, 2006
- 5,392
- 13
- 0
whether or not 'unblack' metal is black metal is purely subjective
the fact is, it sucks. end of story. If I wanted to hear preaching I'd go to church. but I don't go to church anymore, so how about them apples?
the fact is, it sucks. end of story. If I wanted to hear preaching I'd go to church. but I don't go to church anymore, so how about them apples?
Mort Divine
Shrine Maiden of the In-Crowd
The lyrical content in no way influences the quality of the music :\ Lengsel is quite good, and a few others that I can't recall the names of are too - Alkonost perhaps.
Krigloch the Furious
Pants full of poo
skeptik
Member
- Feb 7, 2003
- 24,413
- 71
- 48
satanic bands preach the word of satan.
What about bands like immortal that dont sing about satan. Are they winter metal?
It seems that when it is convenant to rip of christan bands people will.
Similar threads
