Downloading movies: theft or not?

[MadeInNewJersey]

When people download music, it's *often* (I'd like to think) to sample a band before plunking down some hard-earned cash on that band. If they don't like it too much, fine, no harm, no foul.

But when someone downloads a movie, does this change IYO?

An album can be listened to over & over once purchased. But how many movies do people watch more than once or twice?

Thoughts? Argue.

 

[Erik]

No, it's not theft. Theft is taking physical property that you do not own. This is copyright infringement, and copyright is nothing I feel very strongly about so... meh.

 

[MadeInNewJersey]

Not to nitpick, but copyright infringement is 100% theft. Just because it's not walking into a store, slipping a DVD into your jacket and walking out with it doesn't make it any less of theft.

At least IMO, of course.

 

[Conspicuously Absent]

Depends on the movie, person, and many other things. But usually if I download something, i'm sampling it. I'm one of those people that I DO watch good movies repeatedly, if its good, i'll buy it. Most movies suck however.

 

[NAD]

if i watch a movie more than a handful of times, i'll buy it. like albums.

this kind of stuff is obviously piracy, i mean duh. just some people are okay with it and some aren't.

 

[Erik]

Not to nitpick, but copyright infringement is 100% theft. Just because it's not walking into a store, slipping a DVD into your jacket and walking out with it doesn't make it any less of theft.

At least IMO, of course.

No, you're wrong. Juridically, they are two completely different things. If you thieve something from someone, the rightful owner suffers a loss in that he doesn't have the item anymore. Downloading a digital copy of a movie cannot be theft, because noone is losing anything, much less anything physical.

 

[Conspicuously Absent]

Only movies I've ever downloaded: Monty Python holy grail when my copy was stolen, Babylon 5 because the french are thieving bastards and our VHS copies are getting worn out from excessive viewing, Band of Brothers because my parents don't wanna give me the VHS recordings they have, Alice in Wonderland cause I watch it when high.

copyright infringement is a form of theft in that we are stealing the money we would have paid to watch it in the first place.

 

[MadeInNewJersey]

The thing is, that there is no "sampling" of a movie. I mean, do you just watch 5 minutes of it to decide if you want to buy it?

You either go to the theater, or rent it, or buy it. Downloading is 99.9% in place of renting it IMO. I obviously don't have any factoids about it, but if people REALLY want to own a movie, they often rent it and then buy it, no? Sometimes you just buy it outright I guess.

But considering that the rental business is a multi-billion dollar industry in and of itself, downloading instead of even renting is going to have some very bad, widespread ramifications, both for individuals & the industry itself.

 

[MadeInNewJersey]

No, you're wrong. Juridically, they are two completely different things. If you thieve something from someone, the rightful owner suffers a loss in that he doesn't have the item anymore. Downloading a digital copy of a movie cannot be theft, because noone is losing anything, much less anything physical.

Erik, money is being lost, and if that's not the single-most important fact re: theft, I don't know what is. See what I just wrote above.

 

[Erik]

But considering that the rental business is a multi-billion dollar industry in and of itself, downloading instead of even renting is going to have some very bad, widespread ramifications, both for individuals & the industry itself.

Because it would be SO BAD for cinema as an art if Hollywood with all its multi billion dollar companies went under, right

 

[MadeInNewJersey]

Also, FYI, I'm not passing judgement on anyone who CHOOSES to download movies, etc.

Clearly I believe it's the wrong thing to do, but hey, to each their own.

 

[Conspicuously Absent]

Sampling: watch the movie, if its good, i'll go buy it sometime soon. If it's a let down like most movies, i won't go buy it. I don't have enough money to go throw blockbuster or the movie industry money for something I don't even like.

I do the same thing with music and computer games.

 

[Erik]

Erik, money is being lost, and if that's not the single-most important fact re: theft, I don't know what is. See what I just wrote above.

Money IS NOT LOST. You can NEVER prove that money is lost. You can pull made up statistics and "estimates" out of your ass like the movie companies do, but they do not mean SHIT. I could download 50 movies overnight that I have no interest in seeing and delete them first thing in the morning. According to shit logic, this would equal to about $750 in "losses" then?

 

[MadeInNewJersey]

Because it would be SO BAD for cinema as an art if Hollywood with all its multi billion dollar companies went under, right

It certainly wouldn't be good.

If you can't get past your holier-than-thou "I hate all corporations" mindset enough to realize that no entity is an island (i.e. the ripple effect of even just the "big" studios losing this money would cripple the ENTIRE INDUSTRY and beyond that as well), I don't know what to tell you.

You can fight the ideas behind corporations & capitalism all you want, but you certainly can't change the way the world works and is going to work moving forward.

 

[lurch70]

No, you're wrong. Juridically, they are two completely different things. If you thieve something from someone, the rightful owner suffers a loss in that he doesn't have the item anymore. Downloading a digital copy of a movie cannot be theft, because noone is losing anything, much less anything physical.

huh? ... downloading movies is the same thing as downloading music ... the compnay/band that owns the rights to it ... is losing a sale/revenue from a product you did not purchase.

cannot wait to hear J's opinion on this

 

[Erik]

huh? ... downloading movies is the same thing as downloading music ... the compnay/band that owns the rights to it ... is losing a sale/revenue from a product you did not purchase.

cannot wait to hear J's opinion on this

Complete and utter bullshit. Stop listening to MPAA/RIAA propaganda and think for yourself perhaps

 

[Conspicuously Absent]

Because it would be SO BAD for cinema as an art if Hollywood with all its multi billion dollar companies went under, right

Yes, half the towns I live in are very popular places for hollywood to come film nature shit for cheap. Vancouver has a HUGE amount of money come into it because of hollywood movies. Soooo.. yes, it would suck cock.

I don't condone downloading movies with no intent of purchasing it if it is a quality film/game/album. I only download stuff I'm REASONABLY sure I'll enjoy.

 

[MadeInNewJersey]

Money IS NOT LOST. You can NEVER prove that money is lost. You can pull made up statistics and "estimates" out of your ass like the movie companies do, but they do not mean SHIT. I could download 50 movies overnight that I have no interest in seeing and delete them first thing in the morning. According to shit logic, this would equal to about $750 in "losses" then?

Obviously, if you download JUST to download, without any care whatsoever about actually watching the movie, then of course not, no money is actually lost because the assumption is made that you wouldn't have rented the movie in the first place.

A little common sense here, pls k thx.

But if you DO download a movie because you don't want to spend the $8 to see it in a theatre, or the $4 to rent it at home, then how can you possibly say money is not being lost? I don't need a statistic to tell me that, lol.

 

[Erik]

It certainly wouldn't be good.

If you can't get past your holier-than-thou "I hate all corporations" mindset enough to realize that no entity is an island (i.e. the ripple effect of even just the "big" studios losing this money would cripple the ENTIRE INDUSTRY and beyond that as well), I don't know what to tell you.

I don't care for "industries", I care for art.

You can fight the ideas behind corporations & capitalism all you want, but you certainly can't change the way the world works and is going to work moving forward.

This here 500 megaton warhead says differently

 

[Erik]

Obviously, if you download JUST to download, without any care whatsoever about actually watching the movie, then of course not, no money is actually lost because the assumption is made that you wouldn't have rented the movie in the first place.

A little common sense here, pls k thx.

But if you DO download a movie because you don't want to spend the $8 to see it in a theatre, or the $4 to rent it at home, then how can you possibly say money is not being lost? I don't need a statistic to tell me that, lol.

You can NEVER PROVE that person X would rent or buy a movie if he didn't have the chance of downloading it freely. NEVER NEVER EVER. IMPOSSIBLE.