zabu of nΩd
Free Insultation
- Feb 9, 2007
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The Official Good Television Thread
- Thread starter Satanstoenail
- Start date
Einherjar86
Active Member
zabu of nΩd
Free Insultation
- Feb 9, 2007
- 14,620
- 805
- 113
Einherjar86
Active Member
rms
Active Member
Maybe because for at least 5 seasons the ideas behind how the Island works is basically what the show has been about? I guess I see that the creators are trying to put it past us that it was about the characters, but how did they develop? What am I missing? And this alternate purgatory, what did you mean? I don't think I understand the last episode at all, I don't seem to be drawing the conclusions from what you guys are saying at all.
Einherjar86
Active Member
SPOILERS:
This is how I understood it, although others seem to disagree with my interpretation: they all died when the nuke was set off (or at some other point in the story; all the people present in the church at the end were dead). At that point, they're no longer "in time" anywhere. The two separate narratives of the final season represented struggles/conflicts that had not been resolved. They couldn't "move on" until the threat of the island had been put to rest, and they wouldn't understand anything until they had found each other in the "flash-sideways."
No doubt it's sappy and extremely cheesy, but it's more of an emotionally satisfying conclusion, in my opinion.
This is how I understood it, although others seem to disagree with my interpretation: they all died when the nuke was set off (or at some other point in the story; all the people present in the church at the end were dead). At that point, they're no longer "in time" anywhere. The two separate narratives of the final season represented struggles/conflicts that had not been resolved. They couldn't "move on" until the threat of the island had been put to rest, and they wouldn't understand anything until they had found each other in the "flash-sideways."
No doubt it's sappy and extremely cheesy, but it's more of an emotionally satisfying conclusion, in my opinion.
rms
Active Member
yeah just finished it 2 seconds ago. I heard 2.5 hrs but mine was only 2 50 minute segments, im not missing anything am I?
So that church scene was nothing? So fucking confusing like always with the alternate realities, his father said you had to remember like it was two past lifes or something, or they did time on the island and then back to their regular shit life and like true love or true friendship whatever but just found each other. I just never get this damn show man its over and im still confused
So that church scene was nothing? So fucking confusing like always with the alternate realities, his father said you had to remember like it was two past lifes or something, or they did time on the island and then back to their regular shit life and like true love or true friendship whatever but just found each other. I just never get this damn show man its over and im still confused
Einherjar86
Active Member
Haha, yeah, I don't fully understand it. I'm comfortable with coming to my own conclusions though. I think that's more interesting than asking the writers to explain what they intended for it to mean.
cookiecutter
Proceed to Ultraslamming
I don't think they all died at the nuke. I think the nuke merely created the flash-sideways universe, which was out of time, and which served as a gathering place for them all as they died. Jack's dad said they all died at different times but that there was "no now here (purgatory/flash-sideways)".
MasterOLightning
Optimator
I didn't think the ending was particularly hard to understand at all. All of the things that happened other than the alternative timeline actually happened. Everyone died when they died on the show, or later, in the case of the escapees and Hurley, Ben, etc. They met in a reality that existed outside of time, that seemed to be created through some sort of wish fulfillment created by the light from the heart of the island. One could argue that several of the unexplained things about the island solely happened because people believed they would happen, or were under the impression they would happen. (See the donkey wheel, the "rules", remarkable feats of survival.) This seems to be a property of the island that I'm not sure can be explained away beyond that it is just is what the island is.
One troubling aspect of the ending is that the people who returned on the Ajira plane are going to have some serious explaining to do.
One troubling aspect of the ending is that the people who returned on the Ajira plane are going to have some serious explaining to do.
Srontgorrth
Member
Yeah, I wonder what would/will happen to the Ajira plane. And Widmore's entire corporation etc.
Anyways, I think when the bomb got set off, it set of some sort of chain reaction that created an alternate universe where the island does not exist. Some of the characters are better off that way (Hurley obviously, Sawyer being "productive," Sun and Jin having a better relationship, though not being married) and some are similar to where they were in both universes (Locke in the wheelchair with wife/fiance, Kate still on the run etc).
Anyways, I think when the bomb got set off, it set of some sort of chain reaction that created an alternate universe where the island does not exist. Some of the characters are better off that way (Hurley obviously, Sawyer being "productive," Sun and Jin having a better relationship, though not being married) and some are similar to where they were in both universes (Locke in the wheelchair with wife/fiance, Kate still on the run etc).
The Emptier
t3h b3aSt0rZ
Yeah they didn't all die at the same time...cookiecutter is pretty much right, as they all died they went to the church, it was like a VIP in heaven and they all waited for each other until they could finally say goodbye
rms
Active Member
so how come Jack being there last saw them all, wouldnt Jack have been waiting for the survivors? Or the people that died already waiting? Not no one being there and meeting up at the same time, doesn't make sense to me.
what's your take man i'm just trying to see different point of views not necessarily anything else
what's your take man i'm just trying to see different point of views not necessarily anything else
MasterOLightning
Optimator
I've heard it argued that the alternaverse was solely Jack's journey towards whatever afterlife there is, and maybe the other Losties experienced things that were more focused on their own life. Perhaps everything in the alternaverse existed simply to lead his being to the next plane. The finale pretty definitively asserts that Lost was mainly Jack's story, and maybe the main Losties have their version of it too.
Another theory is that Hurley, as protector of the Island, used whatever powers he has/had to create this experience for the dead Jack.
I dislike the references to purgatory, because purgatory is a very specific Catholic concept that does not really reflect what the alternaverse is like, and Lost has bent over backwards to be pantheistic (especially in the last scene) and to ascribe a concept so particular to a certain religion to the the explanation of the ending of the series seems at best to be a bad misunderstanding of purgatory, and at worst to totally miss the point of the ending.
I agree with what I've read that Lost is a commentary on storytelling itself, and this ending seems to affirm that the journey and the connections we make with the characters are more important that what the particulars are/were. To say that this is a story about stories is really the only way to justify the "why" question that so many people really wanted answered by the last episode.
Another theory is that Hurley, as protector of the Island, used whatever powers he has/had to create this experience for the dead Jack.
I dislike the references to purgatory, because purgatory is a very specific Catholic concept that does not really reflect what the alternaverse is like, and Lost has bent over backwards to be pantheistic (especially in the last scene) and to ascribe a concept so particular to a certain religion to the the explanation of the ending of the series seems at best to be a bad misunderstanding of purgatory, and at worst to totally miss the point of the ending.
I agree with what I've read that Lost is a commentary on storytelling itself, and this ending seems to affirm that the journey and the connections we make with the characters are more important that what the particulars are/were. To say that this is a story about stories is really the only way to justify the "why" question that so many people really wanted answered by the last episode.
Jimmy... Dead.
contemplative curmudgeon
^except for the fact that they were in a church and jacks father opens the door into white light?
Looked pretty religious to me.
Looked pretty religious to me.
Vegard Pompey
ALLY TO GOOD, NIGHTMARE TO YOU
I liked the finale. Not the best episode of the series, but a worthy end. Sentimental as hell, but well-earned sentimentality.
SweptbackFlame
twitch.tv/SweptbackFlame
So 24 is sadly over, I think it finished great, because it basically sets it up for the film due out next year (rumors on the date but it is confirmed for a movie).
Einherjar86
Active Member
You're right. I forgot the rest of Christian's explanation.
Mainly, what people have said here; they're all dead at the end.
As cookie quoted, Christian said: "There is no 'now' here." They've gone beyond the reaches of time (which is interesting, when you think about it, considering how important time was throughout the series). Essentially, at different points throughout the course of their respective stories, each character has passed on (some characters died at points that we, as viewers, didn't witness); Jack died where we saw him die; Kate and Sawyer escaped the island (presumably) and died at some later point; Hurley and Ben remained on the island as its "protectors" after Jack died (which is why Hurley told Ben he was a "great number 2"); and so on and so forth.
Before they met each other, they were all lacking something; they were all "lost" (apologies for the tacky pun). It was only after they discovered their relationships and love for one another through the island that they felt whole; so, in the end, they created some place where they could all be together again. It's a sappy ending, but it really serves the emotional purpose of seeing them all reunited. Personally, it's what I wanted.
The character who has intrigued me the most throughout the sixth season is Desmond. He was "enlightened" initially by Charlie, who convinced him that there was some perfect form of love calling out to him. Then, after Desmond was convinced, it was revealed that Charlie actually had to be convinced all over again. I'm still trying to understand why exactly Desmond was the enlightenment figure (other than the obvious philosophical influence on his character); but then again, that's part of the fun of the show.
Yeah, 24 is over too. I have watched all the seasons except for seasons 6 and 7 because it was getting boring, then decided to watch season 8 because it was the last one.
Badbird
Never banned
I knew Beck and them love to listen to Slayer, when trying to blame Obama and all Democrats.
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