NFL 2012
- Thread starter Jimmy... Dead.
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MasterOLightning
Optimator
It looked like they we're pretty willing to run out the clock with dink and dunk plays until there was the personal foul penalty. I don't have a problem with them working out their 2 minute drill, but of course, nothing about preseason football requires that a team wait until the last two minutes to run those plays.
Yeah, so after this week, I sort of agree with King Richard about safely passing on most of preseason football. I watched the entirety of the bad game tonight, and I just didn't see any pro prospects. I find that if the Bears have someone they think has potential, they'll get snaps against first teamers. There were no standouts in that game tonight. Marion Barber played a lot, but everyone knows what he can do, and the fact that Chester Taylor hasn't been cut yet is ridiculous. Taylor is a corpse, and he was last year too. Manumaleuna was an even worse signing. I fear Roy Williams will be as bad a bust as those two. I need to see him at least catch a pass next week. Burress probably would have been a better sign. I like Knox and Bennett, but they aren't elite talents, and Cutler will never excel with a very poor line, and merely good WRs.
Anyway, I saw nothing from anyone in the 2nd half of that game that indicated they could be a contributing NFL player. I hoped to see growth from Caleb Hanie even, but his ceiling is still middling backup QB.
Yeah, so after this week, I sort of agree with King Richard about safely passing on most of preseason football. I watched the entirety of the bad game tonight, and I just didn't see any pro prospects. I find that if the Bears have someone they think has potential, they'll get snaps against first teamers. There were no standouts in that game tonight. Marion Barber played a lot, but everyone knows what he can do, and the fact that Chester Taylor hasn't been cut yet is ridiculous. Taylor is a corpse, and he was last year too. Manumaleuna was an even worse signing. I fear Roy Williams will be as bad a bust as those two. I need to see him at least catch a pass next week. Burress probably would have been a better sign. I like Knox and Bennett, but they aren't elite talents, and Cutler will never excel with a very poor line, and merely good WRs.
Anyway, I saw nothing from anyone in the 2nd half of that game that indicated they could be a contributing NFL player. I hoped to see growth from Caleb Hanie even, but his ceiling is still middling backup QB.
zerostatic
Damned in Flames
I only watched bits and pieces of the second half of the Bears game last night. I was surprised to see Johnny Knox playing that late into the game. He was a starter last year and I believe led the bears in catches and receiving yards so I am confused why he has slid down the depth chart at wide receiver for the Bears. A review of the game reported that 1st stringer Roy Williams dropped a few passes in the first quarter. Between that and the report I read last week in which Williams admitted that he isn't in playing condition I am starting to have serious doubts about how the Bears consider this guy an upgrade over the other wide receivers. I hate to question the coaches, but this is the same team that took the most dangerous return man the NFL has seen in a long time and turned him into an ineffective to mediocre wide receiver.
I Agree with you on Taylor being a bust. For the money the Bears are paying him and that overhyped tight end from last year, Brandon Manumaleuna, they could have gotten some veteran experience on the line to protect Cutler. The rookie WR out of Ohio State, Dane Sanzenbacher made some good catches last night. I would be surprised if the Bears release him.
I Agree with you on Taylor being a bust. For the money the Bears are paying him and that overhyped tight end from last year, Brandon Manumaleuna, they could have gotten some veteran experience on the line to protect Cutler. The rookie WR out of Ohio State, Dane Sanzenbacher made some good catches last night. I would be surprised if the Bears release him.
King Richard
Hello there
skeptik
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So the Steelers locked up yet another of their core young players for the long term, keeping Lawrence Timmons in the black and gold for at least another 6 years to the tune of $50M. Frankly, that's a good price. Timmons is one of the most underrated players in the league. He's a better player than LaMarr Woodley is, and Woodley got $11.5M more than Timmons just did over the same time span. It is, then, fortunate that he is still under-recognized and didn't get named to the Pro Bowl last year like he should have. Woodley is only 26, and Timmons is still 25. With Farrior and Harrison being gone most likely by 2014, and Jason Worilds and Stevenson Sylvester emerging to take their spots, it looks like the Steelers have the nucleus they need to keep their linebacker tradition going.
King Richard
Hello there
crimsonfloyd
Active Member
skeptik
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Well, the only way that final cuts would actually increase the amount of money that a team has to work with is if they cut high-salaried players. Right now, only the top 51 salaries count against the cap, but once the regular season starts, the full 53 man roster plus the practice squad count toward the cap. The Eagles appear to be around $4M under the cap at the moment, and the additional 10 players will add around another $2M, so they should have around $2M to work with.
crimsonfloyd
Active Member
Where are you getting that number for the practice squad salary? Last year the going rate was about $5,000 a week. With ten players that adds up to about $800,000 over the course of the season.
There are a number of players on the Eagles with high salaries that could be cut or traded.
Joselio Hanson: $2.4 mil
Trevor Laws: $1 mil
Jamal Jackson (Mudd doesn't seem keen on him, so he could be trade bait): $1.6 mil
Cutting or trading those three players could clear up $5 million.
skeptik
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Well, first of all, if I came across as sounding that the Eagles are in a bad spot salary cap wise, that was a mistake. They're actually in an alarmingly good position with respect to the cap. I've been reading about their offseason and it's obvious that they have planned for this for perhaps the past two seasons. My point was though that final cuts wouldn't have anything to do with whether or not they can extend DeSean Jackson. The Eagles are obviously comfortable in their position to extend Jackson, and evidence I cite toward this is the fact that they have not split up Michael Vick's new contract in various subsets of signing bonuses and guaranteed money, leaving his 2011 imprint on the salary cap pretty close to what it would have been anyway under the franchise tender. By doing this, they free up money for later years. Now, if they were worried about Jackson, they would have broken up Vick's salary or renegotiated other players' contracts like the Steelers did in order to alleviate the cap hit.
Also, regarding the practice squad salary, I couldn't find my original source, but it appears that I was off anyway. The weekly salary for 2011 is $5700, and it increases to $8400 by 2020 under the new CBA. But that is the 8 players (and teams can pay players any salary on the practice squad; $5700 is the minimum). The other two players are part of the 53 man roster (as I said, the salary cap hit as of now only includes the top 51 salaries). So following final cuts, the additional 10 players, depending on their salaries, would probably be closer to an additional $1.5M, not $2M. But regardless, I wouldn't worry about the Eagles re-signing Jackson; it will definitely happen.
Also, probably the most amazing thing about the Eagles' recent signing spree is that the vast majority of their signings come with no guaranteed money past the 2011 season. Of course, they will have issues crop up shortly in the next couple years. For example, in addition to Jackson still playing on his rookie contract, so is Rodgers-Cromartie. Though, in reality, Asante Samuel may retire or be released or traded in order to make room for R-C's new contract.
Also, regarding the practice squad salary, I couldn't find my original source, but it appears that I was off anyway. The weekly salary for 2011 is $5700, and it increases to $8400 by 2020 under the new CBA. But that is the 8 players (and teams can pay players any salary on the practice squad; $5700 is the minimum). The other two players are part of the 53 man roster (as I said, the salary cap hit as of now only includes the top 51 salaries). So following final cuts, the additional 10 players, depending on their salaries, would probably be closer to an additional $1.5M, not $2M. But regardless, I wouldn't worry about the Eagles re-signing Jackson; it will definitely happen.
Also, probably the most amazing thing about the Eagles' recent signing spree is that the vast majority of their signings come with no guaranteed money past the 2011 season. Of course, they will have issues crop up shortly in the next couple years. For example, in addition to Jackson still playing on his rookie contract, so is Rodgers-Cromartie. Though, in reality, Asante Samuel may retire or be released or traded in order to make room for R-C's new contract.
zerostatic
Damned in Flames
The Chicago Tribune reported that pro bowl linebacker Lance Briggs wants a trade out of Chicago. What an ass to pull this shit a week before the season starts. The Bears also cut Chester Taylor and Desmond Clark. I always like Clark but he isn't getting any younger. I would like to see the Bears make a move to sign Brandon Meriweather to help shore up the Secondary but I doubt it will happen.
skeptik
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Not really many surprises among the Steelers cuts. The few even remotely interesting things:
OT/G Tony Hills was cut in favor of Chris Scott. The former was entering his 4th year as a 4th round pick and had hardly showed anything at tackle, but was having a fair bit of success at right guard and was in line to win the starting job, but evidently the coaches were not impressed enough, and Doug Legursky (who most will know for starting at C for an injured Maurkice Pouncey in the super bowl) will start in his place. Chris Scott is a 2nd year 5th round OT/G who got the first opportunity to win the starting RG spot, but quickly failed. He significantly underperformed during the preseason and I basically view him as a lesser Tony Hills right now. I guess for Hills it was either win a starting position or say goodbye for the front office. Chris Scott has a lot to improve upon in order to justify this cut, although hopefully he'll not see the active roster at all this year.
CB Crezdon Butler was cut, a 2nd year 5th round pick. This cut was certainly a result of a numbers game, and I think that the Steelers were very close to keeping 7 CBs on the roster this year. Ike Taylor and Bryant McFadden are locked in at the starting positions, and the only other CB with starting, or really any, game time experience is William Gay, which is why they re-signed him to a one year deal, so he wasn't going anywhere either. Keenan Lewis has looked pretty good and showed a lot of potential and looks to take over at least the nickel role from Gay at some point this year in his 3rd season. The other two CBs are rookies that they knew they would lose to waivers if they cut, Curtis Brown and Cortez Allen, 3rd nad 4th rounders, respectively. I think Allen may have been close to being cut and snuck onto the practice squad because he was injured all preseason, but he finally got on the field the last game, and actually the first snap he ever plays he deflects a deep pass out of a receiver's hands that the safety then intercepts. He most likely won't contribute at all this year, but after he did finally play, they decided they can't expose him to waivers.
Note: I strongly suspect the Arizona Cardinals will come knocking for Butler. Their new defensive coordinator is Ray Horton, who was the Steelers' secondary coach for most of the past decade, and he liked Butler. Plus, they sign almost every player the Steelers get rid of (short list includes Joey Porter, Clark Haggans, Dan Kreider, Alan Faneca, Bryant McFadden (for 2009), and, most recently, Nick Eason). That's because their head coach was the OC for the Steelers under Cowher, and he left when he didn't win the HC job here.
Finally, possibly the biggest surprise is not somebody getting cut, but somebody making the roster, namely, undrafted rookie tight end Weslye Saunders out of University of South Carolina. He was suspended all of last season, which prevented him from being drafted, but before that, there was speculation that he could be a second rounder. After the Steelers lost Matt Spaeth to free agency, they were in the market for a 2nd string tight end, whose primary role in Bruce Arians' scheme is in-line blocking, like a third tackle basically. The 3rd string, now 2nd string TE, David Johnson, is best utilized in the H-back role in the backfield, however, so when they signed veteran John Gilmore, it was assumed that, given Saunders' novice level of blocking despite displaying lots of determination, Gilmore would serve as the 2nd TE. But Johnson has shown enough where the coaches can now trust him to block on the line and even catch the occasional pass, which allowed them to risk a guarantee of acceptable play from a veteran in favor of the potential that Saunders possesses, who has the potential to be an excellent pass catching TE and has a high ceiling when it comes to him being able to learn how to block on this level of play. They did it with Matt Spaeth, and he looked worse in that role at this stage than Saunders does. I think this was the team's best move when it came to finalizing the 53 man roster.
OT/G Tony Hills was cut in favor of Chris Scott. The former was entering his 4th year as a 4th round pick and had hardly showed anything at tackle, but was having a fair bit of success at right guard and was in line to win the starting job, but evidently the coaches were not impressed enough, and Doug Legursky (who most will know for starting at C for an injured Maurkice Pouncey in the super bowl) will start in his place. Chris Scott is a 2nd year 5th round OT/G who got the first opportunity to win the starting RG spot, but quickly failed. He significantly underperformed during the preseason and I basically view him as a lesser Tony Hills right now. I guess for Hills it was either win a starting position or say goodbye for the front office. Chris Scott has a lot to improve upon in order to justify this cut, although hopefully he'll not see the active roster at all this year.
CB Crezdon Butler was cut, a 2nd year 5th round pick. This cut was certainly a result of a numbers game, and I think that the Steelers were very close to keeping 7 CBs on the roster this year. Ike Taylor and Bryant McFadden are locked in at the starting positions, and the only other CB with starting, or really any, game time experience is William Gay, which is why they re-signed him to a one year deal, so he wasn't going anywhere either. Keenan Lewis has looked pretty good and showed a lot of potential and looks to take over at least the nickel role from Gay at some point this year in his 3rd season. The other two CBs are rookies that they knew they would lose to waivers if they cut, Curtis Brown and Cortez Allen, 3rd nad 4th rounders, respectively. I think Allen may have been close to being cut and snuck onto the practice squad because he was injured all preseason, but he finally got on the field the last game, and actually the first snap he ever plays he deflects a deep pass out of a receiver's hands that the safety then intercepts. He most likely won't contribute at all this year, but after he did finally play, they decided they can't expose him to waivers.
Note: I strongly suspect the Arizona Cardinals will come knocking for Butler. Their new defensive coordinator is Ray Horton, who was the Steelers' secondary coach for most of the past decade, and he liked Butler. Plus, they sign almost every player the Steelers get rid of (short list includes Joey Porter, Clark Haggans, Dan Kreider, Alan Faneca, Bryant McFadden (for 2009), and, most recently, Nick Eason). That's because their head coach was the OC for the Steelers under Cowher, and he left when he didn't win the HC job here.
Finally, possibly the biggest surprise is not somebody getting cut, but somebody making the roster, namely, undrafted rookie tight end Weslye Saunders out of University of South Carolina. He was suspended all of last season, which prevented him from being drafted, but before that, there was speculation that he could be a second rounder. After the Steelers lost Matt Spaeth to free agency, they were in the market for a 2nd string tight end, whose primary role in Bruce Arians' scheme is in-line blocking, like a third tackle basically. The 3rd string, now 2nd string TE, David Johnson, is best utilized in the H-back role in the backfield, however, so when they signed veteran John Gilmore, it was assumed that, given Saunders' novice level of blocking despite displaying lots of determination, Gilmore would serve as the 2nd TE. But Johnson has shown enough where the coaches can now trust him to block on the line and even catch the occasional pass, which allowed them to risk a guarantee of acceptable play from a veteran in favor of the potential that Saunders possesses, who has the potential to be an excellent pass catching TE and has a high ceiling when it comes to him being able to learn how to block on this level of play. They did it with Matt Spaeth, and he looked worse in that role at this stage than Saunders does. I think this was the team's best move when it came to finalizing the 53 man roster.
skeptik
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"Second-year CB Crezdon Butler tweeted Sunday he signed with the Arizona Cardinals, and his former secondary coach Ray Horton - who is now Arizona's defensive coordinator."
Also, I'm not too thrilled with the team's practice squad decisions. Here is what they ended up with:
S Da'Mon Cromartie-Smith
WR Tyler Grisham
OL John Malecki
DT Corbin Bryant
RB John Clay
OT Trevis Turner
LB Mortty Ivy
TE Jamie McCoy
Instead of Malecki or Turner I would have kept 6th round rookie G Keith Williams, and the other lineman spot I would have used to keep CB Donovan Warren. I might have also kept WR Wes Lyons in favor of Tyler Grisham since Lyons has much more upside and the Steelers have an excellent receiving corps already. Cromartie-Smith, Ivy, Clay, McCoy, and Bryant are all good moves, but I would have also liked to see NT Anthony Gray on there as well, or LB Mario Harvey, neither of whom are with any teams yet either.
Krigloch the Furious
Pants full of poo
Im tired of Briggs whining every fucking year. The dude is good, but come the fuck on. Shut your mouth and play football.
He's basically saying if I'm a Bear forever extend my contract or trade me so I can use the potential I have now to further my career with someone who will appreciate me.
Guy is a great lber, pay the mtherfucker!
Guy is a great lber, pay the mtherfucker!
zerostatic
Damned in Flames
Briggs is a great linebacker but he is 30 years old. 3 years ago he signed a six year 36 million dollar contract. I love the Bears but as a fan I have to say play out your contract and stop the complaining. This guy is going to earn more in one year of playing football then I will in my entire career.
Let's not forget that he also crashed his Lamborghini on a Chicago expressway, left the scene of the accident, and then lied to the police and said his car was stolen.
Let's not forget that he also crashed his Lamborghini on a Chicago expressway, left the scene of the accident, and then lied to the police and said his car was stolen.
crimsonfloyd
Active Member
He already got paid. Its absurd that he's making a scene AFTER he recieved the frontloaded half of his contract. When he signed the deal, he knew the second half would be thinner. The bottom line is if you break the contract into a yearly mean average, he is fairly compensated. He does not deserve a raise.
crimsonfloyd
Active Member
My week 1 predictions:
Packers over Saints: No Super Bowl champion has have lost the Thursday season opener the following year.
Steelers over Ravens
Bears over Falcons: Falcons are the most overrated team in the NFL. Not buying Ryan as an elite QB.
Browns over Bengals: I like what the Browns have done this offseason.
Texans over Colts: Without Manning the Colts are mediocre
Titans over Jaguars: Changing pick since the Jags cut their QB
Chiefs over Bills
Eagles over Rams
Lions over Bucs
Cardinals over Panthers
Chargers over Vikings
Seahawks over 49ers: Tarvaris Jackson vs. Alex Smith... can't wait.
Giants over Redskins
Jets over Cowboys
Patriots over Dolphins
Broncos over Radiers: Who knows, they both suck.
Packers over Saints: No Super Bowl champion has have lost the Thursday season opener the following year.
Steelers over Ravens
Bears over Falcons: Falcons are the most overrated team in the NFL. Not buying Ryan as an elite QB.
Browns over Bengals: I like what the Browns have done this offseason.
Texans over Colts: Without Manning the Colts are mediocre
Titans over Jaguars: Changing pick since the Jags cut their QB
Chiefs over Bills
Eagles over Rams
Lions over Bucs
Cardinals over Panthers
Chargers over Vikings
Seahawks over 49ers: Tarvaris Jackson vs. Alex Smith... can't wait.
Giants over Redskins
Jets over Cowboys
Patriots over Dolphins
Broncos over Radiers: Who knows, they both suck.
King Richard
Hello there
Go Colts! 18-0 BABY!!!1111
I'll take a guess as well:
Packers over Saints
Ravens over Steelers
Falcons over Bears
Browns over Bengals
Colts over Texans (homer pick)
Bills over Chiefs
Rams over Eagles
Bucs over Lions
Panthers over Cardinals
Vikings over Chargers
49ers over Seahawks
Redskins over Giants
Cowboys over Jets
Patriots over Dolphins
Raiders over Broncos
I'll take a guess as well:
Packers over Saints
Ravens over Steelers
Falcons over Bears
Browns over Bengals
Colts over Texans (homer pick)
Bills over Chiefs
Rams over Eagles
Bucs over Lions
Panthers over Cardinals
Vikings over Chargers
49ers over Seahawks
Redskins over Giants
Cowboys over Jets
Patriots over Dolphins
Raiders over Broncos
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