opeth and tool

Well I haven't read this whole thread so forgive me if I repeat what someone already said. Death Bearer's bullshit gave me enouigh to comment about.

1.) NU METAL = NEW URBAN METAL. I wish people would quit throwing around terms that they don't fucking understand. New Urban Metal, as in light hip hop and metal elements. Linkin Park = Nu Metal. Godsmack is not. Pressure4-5, Dope, and bands like that are alternative. Popular doesn't = nu metal. How in the hell did you manage to assume that? Nsync = nu metal? Cher = nu metal? The Beatles = nu metal? Tool isn't nu metal. Haven't ever been, aren't, and never will be.

2.) What the fuck is with people with this "stay true to the underground" bullshit? I HOPE Opeth gets huge. TRL huge. Because they deserve it. I hope I turn on the radio one day and here them. I hope that I walk into every cd store in my town and they have something else from them except for a dusty copy of Blackwater Park. Hell, I hope that they tour with Tool, my favorite band, and I don't give a shit how expensive the tickets are. If you don't like it, don't go. I hope that I see people wearing Opeth shirts all over the mall, and I hope that I see Damnation commercials all over TV. Stop thinking you're better than everybody because you can name bands they haven't heard; whoopty doo.

3.) Stop saying Tool aren't "EXTREME metal, grindcore, black/death, etc." Nobody said they were you fuckstick!

4.) To whoever said "Schism" and "Sober" are exactly the same - Try listening without earplugs.
 
Originally posted by Fervisson


I HOPE Opeth gets huge. TRL huge. Because they deserve it. I hope I turn on the radio one day and here them. I hope that I walk into every cd store in my town and they have something else from them except for a dusty copy of Blackwater Park. Hell, I hope that they tour with Tool, my favorite band, and I don't give a shit how expensive the tickets are. If you don't like it, don't go. I hope that I see people wearing Opeth shirts all over the mall, and I hope that I see Damnation commercials all over TV.

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:lol:
 
Masters Apprentice

Adam Jones's technique is very limited and he ends up doing things over and over (pick scrape) but it is perfect for tool and if they had anything changed now it wouldn't be the same ..

if you can't see how tool has refined and defined their sound than you my friend are an ignorant bastard .

You can argue wether or not it's Revolution or Evolution but they have developed into monsters of Prog Hard Rock ..

I found maynard to be a bit immature(lyrically) when I first began listening to them ... but when I bought their latest album and a perfect circle's debut I realized the gift that this man really has ..
he's a nasal bastard but he does it so well and just like it was hard to get used to death vox at first It took time to get used to his vocals as well ...

It's weird though, sometimes I'll be listening to Tool and how perfect everything is and then i'll put on Opeth and I can easily see some of Opeth's flaws (aren't many) ... so I can't really decide between Tool and Opeth but i'd love to see them tour together because after all they are a couple of my favorite bands .
 
Originally posted by Fervisson

2.) What the fuck is with people with this "stay true to the underground" bullshit? I HOPE Opeth gets huge. TRL huge. Because they deserve it. I hope I turn on the radio one day and here them. I hope that I walk into every cd store in my town and they have something else from them except for a dusty copy of Blackwater Park. Hell, I hope that they tour with Tool, my favorite band, and I don't give a shit how expensive the tickets are. If you don't like it, don't go. I hope that I see people wearing Opeth shirts all over the mall, and I hope that I see Damnation commercials all over TV. Stop thinking you're better than everybody because you can name bands they haven't heard; whoopty doo.
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You make a good point

I too hope Opeth become huge they deserve it and I think people deserve to hear better music than the music that is being fed to them now ... if Opeth ad's were plastering mall's , stores, t.v's and t's it would show that this world is actually recognizing true intelligence in music ....
 
Tool= Not Nu-Metal

Tool is my favorite band, and always will be. I saw them live and they were absolutely amazing. Opeth, is also one of my favorite bands. I asbolutely love Opeth. A tour with both bands would be great.:)
 
Maynard is actualy very intelligent with his lyrics. Despite the use of 'vulgar' words every here or there, it's pretty awesome writting.

Adam, I'll admit, could really improve his skills.

Danny though....is on a whole different level from any drummer. He's amazing. The complexity...the strange time sigs....he's simply wonderful. Best drummer ever.
 
Originally posted by jester00
ill keep it simple for you.

i dont care how many albums you have, to compare schism and sober is ignorant.
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Ignorant of what exactly? I listened to both songs and they both have the exact same structure..he obviously used the success of Sober as a sure fire hit in an album of misfires. OH BUT THE RIFF AND THE LYRICS ARE DIFFERENT, THAT'S ENOUGH FOR A RETARDED DISCIPLE OF MAYNARD JAMES "JESUS CHRIST" KEENAN ISN'T IT?

Originally posted by warsofwinter
Masters Apprentice

Adam Jones's technique is very limited and he ends up doing things over and over (pick scrape) but it is perfect for tool and if they had anything changed now it wouldn't be the same ..

if you can't see how tool has refined and defined their sound than you my friend are an ignorant bastard .
Click to expand...
Again, ignorant of what exactly? All the defining Tool ever did was on Undertow, the shitty production and overall sound quality of Undertow merely makes it sound different from Aenima and the Aenima b-sides(I believe they called it Lateralus).

You can argue wether or not it's Revolution or Evolution but they have developed into monsters of Prog Hard Rock ..
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Monsters of Prog Hard Rock? What the fuck? Do you even know what the hell you're talking about..? They're monsters of progressive rock the same way limp bizkit are monsters of metal, and they're hard rock the same way Oasis are(hint: NOT AT ALL). Go earn yourself some fucking musical knowledge, you ignorant shitmolester.

You compare Tool to any prog rock band with a cult following and you'll see the difference. I'll use Radiohead as an example..seeing as how they're my favourite band and all. If any one band stands true to the progressive part of prog rock then it's Radiohead. Every single album is it's own unique subgenre of rock..whereas Tool is just the same monotone vocals and riffs that sound exactly the same mixed in with a bunch of songs that all sound like Eulogy. Progressive my arse.
 
Originally posted by Masters Apprentice
Ignorant of what exactly? I listened to both songs and they both have the exact same structure..he obviously used the success of Sober as a sure fire hit in an album of misfires. OH BUT THE RIFF AND THE LYRICS ARE DIFFERENT, THAT'S ENOUGH FOR A RETARDED DISCIPLE OF MAYNARD JAMES "JESUS CHRIST" KEENAN ISN'T IT?


Again, ignorant of what exactly? All the defining Tool ever did was on Undertow, the shitty production and overall sound quality of Undertow merely makes it sound different from Aenima and the Aenima b-sides(I believe they called it Lateralus).


Monsters of Prog Hard Rock? What the fuck? Do you even know what the hell you're talking about..? They're monsters of progressive rock the same way limp bizkit are monsters of metal, and they're hard rock the same way Oasis are(hint: NOT AT ALL). Go earn yourself some fucking musical knowledge, you ignorant shitmolester.

You compare Tool to any prog rock band with a cult following and you'll see the difference. I'll use Radiohead as an example..seeing as how they're my favourite band and all. If any one band stands true to the progressive part of prog rock then it's Radiohead. Every single album is it's own unique subgenre of rock..whereas Tool is just the same monotone vocals and riffs that sound exactly the same mixed in with a bunch of songs that all sound like Eulogy. Progressive my arse.
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MA, there is clearly an evolution from Opiate to Undertow to Æenima to Lateralus. Adam Jones is not a technical wizard, but he does job... and he does it well. Danny is otherworldly, Justin is a solid player. Maynard writes intelligent lyrics just as much as Mikael.


...But then again... I'm biased.:lol:
 
The only new thing they added after Undertow were songs like Eulogy and Disposition with the softer vocals. I haven't heard Opiate so I won't comment..but from what I've heard it's not as good as Undertow..so I'm not even going to bother with it. Aenima was the peak of Tool's career..Lateralus just showed they had run out of ways to rearrange the same formula.

Don't get me wrong here, Tool ARE better than most mainstream stuff, but the way so many of their rabid fanboys open their mouths and start talking shit just pisses me off. They are NOTHING in the progressive rock scene, they played at Ozzfest for fuck sake..discussion over.
 
I can't stand Radiohead's singer so any negative comments about Maynard's vocals make me laugh my ass off. That whiny guy can't compare to Maynard... his vocals are nowhere near as powerful or captivating. Radiohead might be progressive out the wazoo but that doesn't neccessarily make it good music. I don't think Lateralus sounds anything like Undertow, so yes I would also say you're ignorant for saying they're just using the same structure over and over. The same could be said for Opeth and many other bands if you want to twist it around like that. Being different and exploring all sorts of musical ideas like Radiohead might make you more creative artistically but it doesn't mean you're going to have better songs, at least not to my ears. Much of Radiohead's material seemed unfocused to me, especially their latest stuff. I do like Lateralus significantly less than Aenima though. Disposition is a waste of track and that album needs some serious energy towards the end of it.
 
I actually got into Opeth because people compared it to Tool. Numerous people were going on and on about how one note of Opeth completely obliterated everything Tool had ever done, and how Tool was in effect a crippled mosquito in comparison to the gods that were Opeth.

Opeth came in with all biases against them. Up until then I had never heard a band even approaching Tool. Their music just appeals to my personal tastes more than any other band I've heard. So I gave Opeth a try with the preconceived opinion: "They're over-rated".

Well, Opeth took that preconceived opinion and beat the holy hell out of it. A few months later, I've bought all of their CDs and can't find one song I don't like.

Tool and Opeth both share the #1 slot, alternating back and forth depending on which one I'm listening to at the moment. Both bands accomplish their goal in very different ways, and in many areas the weaknesses of one bad are the strengths of the other. Tool has more emotional energy, and their songs rarely feel like a stream of riffs pasted end on end. One of my major complaints about Opeth is most of their songs lack true climaxes. Bleak is one of my favorite songs, but about 3/4 of the way through it just repeats itself, instead of giving us a good finisher. Tool are much better and making songs that actually go someplace without adhering to the stone-set structure of most mainstream rock. With the proper buildup, progression, and juxtaposition of segments, a guitar chord that never would have liften your eyebrow by itself can become the most emotion piece of music you've ever heard.

While Opeth songs are usually just riffs pasted end on end, they are EXTREMELY good riffs pasted end on end. Their soft sections are soothing, the heavy sections empowering, the transitionals perfect.

Tool could never pull of The Funeral Portrait, Opeth could never pull of Third Eye. People who love Opeth for their style of music may not appreciate Tool's method, and vice versa.
 
Originally posted by Cynical Bastard
I can't stand Radiohead's singer so any negative comments about Maynard's vocals make me laugh my ass off. That whiny guy can't compare to Maynard... his vocals are nowhere near as powerful or captivating. Radiohead might be progressive out the wazoo but that doesn't neccessarily make it good music. I don't think Lateralus sounds anything like Undertow, so yes I would also say you're ignorant for saying they're just using the same structure over and over. The same could be said for Opeth and many other bands if you want to twist it around like that. Being different and exploring all sorts of musical ideas like Radiohead might make you more creative artistically but it doesn't mean you're going to have better songs, at least not to my ears. Much of Radiohead's material seemed unfocused to me, especially their latest stuff. I do like Lateralus significantly less than Aenima though. Disposition is a waste of track and that album needs some serious energy towards the end of it.
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You don't like 'Radiohead's singer'(now who's being ignorant)s vocals? That's actually quite surprising to me..his vocals are why I love the band so much, he can soar from a deep bassy tone to a high pitched wail so effortlessly and effectively. I guess you prefer the same boring tone over and over to some vocal diversity.

But hey, if you don't like Radiohead that's fine with me, unlike most Tool fans I do understand that their music isn't to everyones tastes and that having a negative opinion of their music doesn't make them ignorant(as you seem to think). I didn't say the used the same structure over and over, I said Sober and Schism have the same structure, way to make shit up there, ace.

And yeah, I love Radiohead's music purely because it's experimental..and not because they create the most jaw droppingly emotional and powerful songs. Their diversity as an artist is what makes them my favourite band, but first and foremost their music is what I love.

Out of interest, name some Radiohead songs you've listened to? At least I know Tools material before forming an opinion, you sound like you've listened to one song and based your entire opinion around it, which is ignorant.

PS - Disposition is the my favourite Tool song(out of above 5 I actually can listen to) and you find it a waste of a track. Go figure.
 
Originally posted by Masters Apprentice
You don't like 'Radiohead's singer'(now who's being ignorant)s vocals? That's actually quite surprising to me..his vocals are why I love the band so much, he can soar from a deep bassy tone to a high pitched wail so effortlessly and effectively. I guess you prefer the same boring tone over and over to some vocal diversity.

But hey, if you don't like Radiohead that's fine with me, unlike most Tool fans I do understand that their music isn't to everyones tastes and that having a negative opinion of their music doesn't make them ignorant(as you seem to think). I didn't say the used the same structure over and over, I said Sober and Schism have the same structure, way to make shit up there, ace.

And yeah, I love Radiohead's music purely because it's experimental..and not because they create the most jaw droppingly emotional and powerful songs. Their diversity as an artist is what makes them my favourite band, but first and foremost their music is what I love.

Out of interest, name some Radiohead songs you've listened to? At least I know Tools material before forming an opinion, you sound like you've listened to one song and based your entire opinion around it, which is ignorant.

PS - Disposition is the my favourite Tool song(out of above 5 I actually can listen to) and you find it a waste of a track. Go figure.
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Well I don't see how I could be considered ignorant for disliking someone's vocals so I wont even address that. I don't look down on anyone for not liking Tool's music and there's nothing wrong with having a negative opinion on it. Some of my best friends don't like Tool and it doesn't bother me. My comments about song structures were more referring to how you previously said Tool haven't really done much different since Undertow, or something similar to that. Sorry I wasn't clear, no need to be hostile and make with the insulting nicknames, slick. :p When you say something like Sober and Schism have the same structure, I think... and your point iiiss? They might have the same basic structure but the songs have a completely different feel to them in every way I can think of, and the structure being the same wouldn't stick out to me unless I compared the two. It seems like a nitpicking observation about their music to me, but if you dislike it I can understand that.

I respect your love of Radiohead's music and their experimentation; it just seems you come down on Tool pretty hard for not matching your own current music tastes, almost like you're trying to make people ashamed for Tool being their favorite band and that they haven't sought out what you believe to be truly progressive music in a higher form... you could say I'm making shit up now, but that's just the strong vibe I get from your posts.

In my Art Major class last year, a few people played Radiohead on a fairly regular basis. Sitting about three feet from the radio, I heard the duration of the albums Kid A and Ok Computer at least three times a week about every other week. True, I couldn't give you specific song titles and I'm not gonna be a cheater and look them up... but I've heard 2 albums enough times to make a fair judgement of them.

To me, Disposition is their most boring track to date. It's extremely repetitive and it doesn't take you anywhere from beginning to end, at least in my opinion. Songs like Third Eye, H, and 46 & 2 make it look like a rainy day experimental joke.
 
MA, have you actually taken the time to listen to Schism and Sober throughly? They're like apples and oranges. It's ignorant to judge two songs without actually listening to them.

Originally posted by Masters Apprentice
The only new thing they added after Undertow were songs like Eulogy and Disposition with the softer vocals. I haven't heard Opiate so I won't comment..but from what I've heard it's not as good as Undertow..so I'm not even going to bother with it. Aenima was the peak of Tool's career..Lateralus just showed they had run out of ways to rearrange the same formula.

Don't get me wrong here, Tool ARE better than most mainstream stuff, but the way so many of their rabid fanboys open their mouths and start talking shit just pisses me off. They are NOTHING in the progressive rock scene, they played at Ozzfest for fuck sake..discussion over.
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So now are you saying Tool's a crap-ass band for playing at Ozzfest and Lollapalooza or any other big-name tour? Just because they sell too many records to be labeled underground makes them bad? Here are a few good bands that sold a few records: Soundgarden, AIC, Radiohead (yeah, them too!), Nirvana, Pearl Jam, Led Zepplin, the Beatles, and, oh yeah, TOOL!!!!! So if you're telling that "ignorant shitmolester" to learn some musical knowledge, you need to also.

P.S. Just because someone voices their own opinion doesn't mean you need to call them as many of the worst insults and obscenties you can possibly think of. Lay the fuck off.
 
I haven't been online for a couple of days and look what i miss out on!!!

I wouldn't know where to start....and seeing as i'm a bit late coming to this discussion i'll keep it short (well, as short as possible).

One thing that annoys the shit out of me is fuck head metal heads who thing that a band has to stay 'underground' to be cool or good. How stupid can you be? Tool's music communicates with a bigger audience for a reason. It's fucking good music. Simple. A lot of your death metal bands stay underground cos they sound like shit and have no talent. To those of you that like being the rebel and being into a band simply cos they're underground, stay cool man. You can keep your shit music to yourself.

Tool are far from mainstream anyway. They don't have any radio-friendly songs and sound nothing like the nu-metal movement. To say that they are nu-metal is plain stupid.

Sober and Schism have the same structure? This doesn't even warrant a comment.......um........i can't resist....... first of all they don't. Second of all I can name quite a few Opeth songs that have the same structure. You're an idiot.

I listen to a lot of metal, including the majority of bands that have been mentioned here. I am a fan of only a few though, based on only one thing, the quality of the music, not how anti-mainstream i'd look wearing their t-shirt.

By the way, Tool and Opeth wouldn't really compliment each other on the one stage.
 
Originally posted by Cynical Bastard
I do like Lateralus significantly less than Aenima though. Disposition is a waste of track and that album needs some serious energy towards the end of it.
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I had to reply to this..........

That's ridiculous!!!!!!!! Disposition is a lead into Reflection, and if Reflection is not enough energy at the end of Lateralus, then you must be deaf.

Reflection is the single most powerful song i have heard in my life.
 
Originally posted by redreflection
I haven't been online for a couple of days and look what i miss out on!!!

I wouldn't know where to start....and seeing as i'm a bit late coming to this discussion i'll keep it short (well, as short as possible).

One thing that annoys the shit out of me is fuck head metal heads who thing that a band has to stay 'underground' to be cool or good. How stupid can you be? Tool's music communicates with a bigger audience for a reason. It's fucking good music. Simple. A lot of your death metal bands stay underground cos they sound like shit and have no talent. To those of you that like being the rebel and being into a band simply cos they're underground, stay cool man. You can keep your shit music to yourself.

Tool are far from mainstream anyway. They don't have any radio-friendly songs and sound nothing like the nu-metal movement. To say that they are nu-metal is plain stupid.

Sober and Schism have the same structure? This doesn't even warrant a comment.......um........i can't resist....... first of all they don't. Second of all I can name quite a few Opeth songs that have the same structure. You're an idiot.

I listen to a lot of metal, including the majority of bands that have been mentioned here. I am a fan of only a few though, based on only one thing, the quality of the music, not how anti-mainstream i'd look wearing their t-shirt.

By the way, Tool and Opeth wouldn't really compliment each other on the one stage.
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100% agree
 
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