Would you call Opeth a mainstream band?

[Demilich]

Blood Duster and Lynchmada are definitly NOT mainstream. Blood Duster play extreme death/grind, and Lynchmada play melodic death metal. But here in Aus, they're popular for doing something different, and something original.[/size]

I have a few problems with this...
1) Independant charts probably aren't the best way to judge what's mainstream.
2) I've never heard these bands, but those genres you mention, are they really that original? Just cause they aren't doing what gets them MTV (or whatever the equivalent is Down Under) doesn't make them so.
3) Does Opeth's DVD being in the Chart section in major record store chains make them any more mainstream? (If you don't know, it's a section for the best-selling dvds or cds in the store) Keep in mind that mainstream doesnt = sellout.

 

[Nico]

I have a few problems with this...
1) Independant charts probably aren't the best way to judge what's mainstream.
2) I've never heard these bands, but those genres you mention, are they really that original? Just cause they aren't doing what gets them MTV (or whatever the equivalent is Down Under) doesn't make them so.
3) Does Opeth's DVD being in the Chart section in major record store chains make them any more mainstream? (If you don't know, it's a section for the best-selling dvds or cds in the store) Keep in mind that mainstream doesnt = sellout.

1) You'd be right... but hey, charts depictive of selling power.
2) Different and original in the sense that they arent what MOST people listen to.
3) No-one said mainstream meant sellouts. If they sell lots of DVD's, lots of people know about them, and that makes them popular, whether they play mainstream music or not.

 

[KielbasaSausage]

My cousin doesn't know black sabbath and led zeppelin. Mozart and Beethoven didn't deal with bloody record companies to sell.

Beethoven was the first musician to start "royalties;" he demanded it from his publishers, and soon this idea spread to other artists. Although they didnt sell records, they sold many of his transcripts to the public, and for this Beethoven made most of his wage. WHAT A FUCKIN SELLOUT! :Smug:

One of the most popular people in the world is Daler Mehndi, but you dont know who the hell he is because he is a famous artist in India. More people know about him than Britney Spears, but just because your cousin doesnt know who he is, he's not famous/"sellout"? Think about that genius.

 

[Nico]

I'd say being famous/sellout is usualy associated with pop-culture

 

[Demoke]

Beethoven was the first musician to start "royalties;" he demanded it from his publishers, and soon this idea spread to other artists. Although they didnt sell records, they sold many of his transcripts to the public, and for this Beethoven made most of his wage. WHAT A FUCKIN SELLOUT!

When did I say Beethoven was a sell-out, dude?

One of the most popular people in the world is Daler Mehndi, but you dont know who the hell he is because he is a famous artist in India. More people know about him than Britney Spears, but just because your cousin doesnt know who he is, he's not famous/"sellout"? Think about that genius.

this is just like saying that chinese is the most important language for, say, business just because it is the most spoken language in the world... think about that, genius. I think you're mixing up "bacon" with "speed," if you know what I mean.

 

[KielbasaSausage]

look moron - you implied beethoven was a sellout because of your irrational logic that popularity means sellout. politics has nothing to do with pop culture and music. Daler Mehndi has more money and more bitches than any artist you can think of. Your logic is this: just because your stupid cousin doesnt know who someone is then they are not well known or a successful artist - isnt that the most retarded way to think about music in general?

You can "feel" when a band becomes mainstream.

just the way i "feel" that you're a complete moron.

The way I "feel" it is by means of my cousin: if she knows the band, then it is mainstream; if she doesn't, then it is not. She doesn't know Opeth. She does know Metallica, Eminem, Nickelback, In Flames, Within Temptation, Alanis Morissette, Nirvana, Enrique Iglesias and his father, and other bullshit.

The lead singer of Nickelback loves Opeth. Therefore Opeth is a fuckin sellout band because that idiot knows who they are. *obvious sarcasm for the retards in this thread*

 

[mot-]

This leads to another question:

Who's the retard ? The one who didnt get the logic right or the one who isnt able to take part in a discussion in an intelligent and friendly way ?

 

[spigot]

Umm... just for continuity sake, Daler Mehndi(and the whole bhangra pop scene) sold out a around 4 years ago.
I'm in India and I've seen everything from Deicide to Candlemass to Bruzum to Impaled Nazarene in stores but not opeth. Hell, even the salesmen haven't heard of them. So I guess its probably a couple of years too early to call Opeth mainstream. They will be in the future though.

 

[KielbasaSausage]

This leads to another question:
Who's the retard ? The one who didnt get the logic right or the one who isnt able to take part in a discussion in an intelligent and friendly way ?

oh no you dont understand anything, but worst of all you think im mean...









fuckin hippie.

 

[Demoke]

1) Opeth are not mainstream.
2) You can "feel" when a band becomes mainstream.
3) The way I "feel" it is by means of my cousin: if she knows the band, then it is mainstream; if she doesn't, then it is not. She doesn't know Opeth. She does know Metallica, Eminem, Nickelback, In Flames, Within Temptation, Alanis Morissette, Nirvana, Enrique Iglesias and his father, and other bullshit. ;-)

This is what you replied to this post:

pretty much everyone knows who led zepplin and black sabbath is. are they sellouts as well? mozart and beethoven too...

Dear KielbasaSausage,

I quote these two messages to explain to you something because you have said things of me which I haven't said. What I mean by "knowing a band" is knowing some of their songs, especially those aired on the radio, in the supermarket, top of the pops, and all those mechanisms to control people's likes at the time of buying a CD. Then, I'm sorry if you understand "knowing a band" like knowing just their name. "My cousin," which here is meant not as my real cousin but all those people whose tastes are controlled by the media, may know the name Beethoven (in fact she does). My logic is not, I quote:

Your logic is this: just because your stupid cousin doesnt know who someone is then they are not well known or a successful artist - isnt that the most retarded way to think about music in general?

but that the music my cousin listens to is mainstream. Beethoven and so on are "famous" but not "mainstream" (by the way, please give me a definition of what mainstream is, just in case I'm also mixed up). I think "mainstream" means "trendy" or "fashionable," doesn't it? And this is what we were discussing here.

A "sell-out" is something different -I hope the example of "Metallica" with their infamous "St. Anger" can help you understand.

Your last quote:

The lead singer of Nickelback loves Opeth. Therefore Opeth is a fuckin sellout band because that idiot knows who they are. *obvious sarcasm for the retards in this thread*

Your sarcasm is sharp and subtle: congratulations, dude.

 

[KielbasaSausage]

I think "mainstream" means "trendy" or "fashionable," doesn't it? And this is what we were discussing here.

that seems like a reasonable definition. but now you are going to have to include all death/black/goth/etc metal as mainstream as well. Most metal fans are known for following a certain trend or fashion (clothes, behavior, ideals, tastes, etc.), and might I add that this trend/fashion is as stupid and childish as "mainstream" fads.
I dont see how defining trend or fashion has anything to do with music, especially mainstream music. This thread shows how most metal fans are stuck up and elitist, especially when it comes to comparing their favorite bands to another's favorite bands. Noone has shown me how people like eminem have "sold out;" if they have originally grown up with this culture and have come to accept it as a valid living then where along the line have they "sold out?"
Also, i noticed that most metal fans are saddened when their favorite metal acts become more popular. This is, of course, because of their stupidity and selfishness; just another example of a poor/disadvantaged person trying to bring down others with potential down with them.

Your sarcasm is sharp and subtle: congratulations, dude.

only because i pointed it out to you.

 

[Demoke]

Yeah, you're right: "mainstream" needs further definition. It can be music listened to by a majority of the population. This majority, the "mass" of the people, is the one controlled by the media, record companies and the whole business.

Fashion and trends in connection with music are very related to the time when the music is popular. Remember the hit "Macarena" by "Los del Rio" was once pretty fashionable. However it would be outdated if you plan to play at a party next weekend... If the music cannot be so well sold anymore, then companies may stop supporting the artist. Take the example of Michael Jackson, who may not sell right now as many CDs as his sister Janet, does he?

A singer or a band "sells out" when they abandon their principles for some reasons (like money). Metallica has sold out as soon as they've tried to accomodate their music to the taste of the mass of people, who is later going to purchase the CDs. Opeth would sell out as soon as they create the music that we, the fans, would like to listen to, say by making another Blackwater Park or another Damnation.

Some metal fans don't get sad because their fave band becomes more popular when it's become more popular, but when they have achieved success by altering their music. Take the example of Dream Theater and their "Train of Thought." Compare it with, for instance, their "Images and Words" and now tell me if an old fan would like the new CD as much as the older one. The thing is, by using this "new" style, the music is more "listenable" to a wider audience, which will result in more € or $. The creation, the music, is the one "under par" for the people who liked a band from the beginning and this is really sad, I think.

And the last thing, thank you for not calling me "moron" and "retard" in your last post.

 

[KielbasaSausage]

had a bad day; last few posts were displaced.

but i still dont understand why people have to complain about bands that "sell-out" or go "mainstream." if you dont like the music, then dont listen to it.

ill agree with you in that less quality in music becomes apparent when the artist is trying to reach a larger audience. however, most of metal fans (especialy black and death) dont even pay attention to the music quality, but to how much attention the band receives. if a band sounds like shit, its top notch because they have a few dozen fans.

 

[MightyA]

faggots will be faggots

AND THAT'S THE BOTTOM LINE

'CAUSE MIGHTY FUCKING A SAID SO!!

 

[Nico]

Well he's in a good mood ^

 

[GreatPhoenix]

Eat shit, Ass! Metal fans can be the most retarded people you will ever communicate to.

I said it in precisely that manner just to see if I could provoke this and I did. Awesome!