Bands selling out/Mainstream bands

[Matthauz]

I've seen a lot on here of metalheads bitching about bands that are mainstream, such as Lamb Of God, one of my personal favourites. Simply saying :

"They're too mainstream, and that makes them shit"

It makes me sick when people bitch about bands becoming mainstream.

People start bands to make music and get famous, to put their music out and touch as many people as possible. That's what music is about, making a buck or two is a bonus and merely a result of our culture.

I'm sure most bands would still be just as happy if instead of getting money for their music they simply got everyone in the world who digged it to come up to them and say 'you rock, your music stirrs something inside of me, that makes me disconnect from the normal world' (that's how music makes me feel anyway), or words to that effect.

Lamb Of God are pretty mainstream compaired to say Urban Nightmare or someone (who? you say, exactly.) but they are by no means as mainstream and popular as say Slayer, but I don't hear people bitching about Slayer 'selling out'.

Simply, if a band is a good band and people dig them they will become mainstream, so I don't wanna hear anyone saying a band is shit because they have lots of fans that buy their records. You people that say that are narrow minded fools.

Me, I think Lamb Of God fucking rock, and I couldn't give two shits if they were mainstream or not.



I'm sure a lot of bands to sell out purposefully, a perfect example being Powerman 5000 who openly admit it but please people, try and understand the economics of :

Good music = fans = mainstreamness

I'd like to hear a how man people would complain if say... (insert rather unknown metal band here) became mainstream and were in the billboard top 10.

If say Opeth did it, top of the billboard charts, I wouldn't be like "Opeth are shit now theyre mainstream", I'd simply say "I don't REALLY care, but good for them".

Would you rather be solitary in knowing a band rocks or would you like all your mates to think they rock too?

I think the latter would make life a lot more fun.

 

[Zivilyn]

Everyone's gonna argue with you, but I agree with most of that. It's just metal... People wanna be tr00, y'know? It's not going to stop until the genre gets an enema, nothing's going to stop it. People are still gonna go out searching for bands that have only sold a few copies, and say they're godly, and look down on you for not knowing them. In a way, I think that's pretty sybolic of how downhill metal's sinking.

 

[Matthauz]

Y'know that's just life, people can argue with me but I know I'm right.

No band is better than another just because they have less fans, and because someone has heard them and i haven't. In fact theyre likely to be worse if they have less fans or indeed I havent heard of them...

 

[CF87]

Lamb of God has cheap plastic production jobs that might turn people off. The thing is why listen to a unoriginal newer band like LoG with lousy weak solos here & there when you can listen to a real metal band that goes all out. It's not really a matter of wanting to be underground but spending time finding artists. Why listen to the same few new bands that the media puts on you. If you love music and are going to sit on a computer all day/night why not look into the music.

 

[Matthauz]

Hey i listen to a lot of metal ok, a lot of other music too, I'm not saying people aren't allowed to look into music, but dont poo poo it because it's mainstream.

 

[Thanatopsis123]

In fact theyre likely to be worse if they have less fans or indeed I havent heard of them...

Yeah, I totally agree.

Hey, have you heard the band Lemonparty? They're very similar to LoG but not quite as good. You should check them out. I forget their website though I'm sure you can find it.

 

[Hammer of Might]

I think the flaw of your argument is this - you suggest that people's objection is the simple fact that a band is IN the mainstream, ie. they get a lot of exposure from the mass media, play all the big modern rock festivals, or whatever.

However, the real objection that anyone who is intelligent has is surely not the simple fact that they happen to be IN the mainstream, but rather that their SOUND is very much one that is a mainstream style which they don't happen to like for the style.

To simplify this, I'll take your example - Lamb of God. You are saying people hate them for the simple fact that they are mainstream. I would suggest that rather, people hate the aspects of their SOUND that conform to what happens to currently be a very mainstream direction. e.g. they don't like the groovey riffs and their lack of prominence in the songs, they think the drums are too simplistic, they don't like the metalcore vocal approach...whatever.

My point is, I don't think people have a problem with the simple fact that these bands happen to be part of the mainstream music 'scene' - or at least not past the fact that they feel annoyed that these bands get so much exposure - but rather that they dislike the very characteristics of the band's sound that have enabled them to be part of the mainstream.

 

[Sinister Mephisto]

I think the flaw of your argument is this - you suggest that people's objection is the simple fact that a band is IN the mainstream, ie. they get a lot of exposure from the mass media, play all the big modern rock festivals, or whatever.

However, the real objection that anyone who is intelligent has is surely not the simple fact that they happen to be IN the mainstream, but rather that their SOUND is very much one that is a mainstream style which they don't happen to like for the style.

To simplify this, I'll take your example - Lamb of God. You are saying people hate them for the simple fact that they are mainstream. I would suggest that rather, people hate the aspects of their SOUND that conform to what happens to currently be a very mainstream direction. e.g. they don't like the groovey riffs and their lack of prominence in the songs, they think the drums are too simplistic, they don't like the metalcore vocal approach...whatever.

My point is, I don't think people have a problem with the simple fact that these bands happen to be part of the mainstream music 'scene' - or at least not past the fact that they feel annoyed that these bands get so much exposure - but rather that they dislike the very characteristics of the band's sound that have enabled them to be part of the mainstream.

Well put.

 

[Idunnonuten]

Lamb of God has cheap plastic production jobs that might turn people off. The thing is why listen to a unoriginal newer band like LoG with lousy weak solos here & there when you can listen to a real metal band that goes all out. It's not really a matter of wanting to be underground but spending time finding artists. Why listen to the same few new bands that the media puts on you. If you love music and are going to sit on a computer all day/night why not look into the music.

When i hear LoG i think Dewscented straight up. (but I still like them, Dewscented is just better).

I 100% agree with this thread. People should spend more time listening than putting on a fucking show, "look at me, I'm dark I only listen to underground metal because I'm a 'true' metal head."
First on my list of bands stuck in this category is Dimmu Borgir. They're fucking awesome and people over look this because some dumbass along the lines compared them to Cradle of Filth (probably when they toured together). When i listen to Dimmu I hear more of an Emperor-esque sound.
Point being that everyone says they aren't true black metal "anymore". BULL SHIT! They are making the exact same music with the same symphonic infuenced black metal as always. the only thing that has changed is their production quality, and I really think the quality better fits their style (I like the new Stormblast much more).

Bottom line, pay attention to the music and quit putting so much effort into noncomforty. that's soooo totally not metal.

Mainstream bands that suck:
Dream Theatre (first on purpose)
Metallica
The Haunted
Children of Bodom
Cradle of Filth

 

[Phrozenspite]

High on Maiden is spot on... if a band is able to acheive mainstream success without sacrificing artistic integrity(note there is a difference between that and simply changing your sound)... a good example of a band who sold out is In Flames, Dimmu and Emperor however would not be as they added more complex elements which alienated their tr00 kvlt fans

 

[TylerTheNuke]

I think the flaw of your argument is this - you suggest that people's objection is the simple fact that a band is IN the mainstream, ie. they get a lot of exposure from the mass media, play all the big modern rock festivals, or whatever.

However, the real objection that anyone who is intelligent has is surely not the simple fact that they happen to be IN the mainstream, but rather that their SOUND is very much one that is a mainstream style which they don't happen to like for the style.

To simplify this, I'll take your example - Lamb of God. You are saying people hate them for the simple fact that they are mainstream. I would suggest that rather, people hate the aspects of their SOUND that conform to what happens to currently be a very mainstream direction. e.g. they don't like the groovey riffs and their lack of prominence in the songs, they think the drums are too simplistic, they don't like the metalcore vocal approach...whatever.

My point is, I don't think people have a problem with the simple fact that these bands happen to be part of the mainstream music 'scene' - or at least not past the fact that they feel annoyed that these bands get so much exposure - but rather that they dislike the very characteristics of the band's sound that have enabled them to be part of the mainstream.

Exactly. I for one enjoy the mainstream sound somewhat, except for some annoying characteristics. Like tool, I dig them. I hate slipknot.

 

[MasterOLightning]

I think the OP articulates his perspective well, but the reason people don't like LoG is for their music, not for their popularity. Mastodon is an example of a band roughly as popular (or will be soon enough) that is still well respected because they have artistic integrity but they happen to be rather accessible. It's all about the music. Some people jump on the bandwagon, but there reaches a point when enough intelligent people say that a band sucks, I can trust that I don't need to listen to them, hence, I've never really heard much Slipknot and not more than a handful of CoF or CoB songs. What I have heard of those has been nothing special.

People dislike Dimmu Borgir because they have boring guitar work. The synth work is good if you really dig that sort of thing, but DB's riffing bores me to tears most of the time.

I think many are also getting tired of the modern extreme metal sound. It seems like many DM and metalcore albums end up sounding very much alike, production wise. The comparative variety in the more unknown bands is what draws people to that.

 

[Draconian]

I've seen a lot on here of metalheads bitching about bands that are mainstream, such as Lamb Of God, one of my personal favourites. Simply saying :

"They're too mainstream, and that makes them shit"

It makes me sick when people bitch about bands becoming mainstream.

People start bands to make music and get famous, to put their music out and touch as many people as possible. That's what music is about, making a buck or two is a bonus and merely a result of our culture.

I'm sure most bands would still be just as happy if instead of getting money for their music they simply got everyone in the world who digged it to come up to them and say 'you rock, your music stirrs something inside of me, that makes me disconnect from the normal world' (that's how music makes me feel anyway), or words to that effect.

Lamb Of God are pretty mainstream compaired to say Urban Nightmare or someone (who? you say, exactly.) but they are by no means as mainstream and popular as say Slayer, but I don't hear people bitching about Slayer 'selling out'.

Simply, if a band is a good band and people dig them they will become mainstream, so I don't wanna hear anyone saying a band is shit because they have lots of fans that buy their records. You people that say that are narrow minded fools.

Me, I think Lamb Of God fucking rock, and I couldn't give two shits if they were mainstream or not.



I'm sure a lot of bands to sell out purposefully, a perfect example being Powerman 5000 who openly admit it but please people, try and understand the economics of :

Good music = fans = mainstreamness

I'd like to hear a how man people would complain if say... (insert rather unknown metal band here) became mainstream and were in the billboard top 10.

If say Opeth did it, top of the billboard charts, I wouldn't be like "Opeth are shit now theyre mainstream", I'd simply say "I don't REALLY care, but good for them".

Would you rather be solitary in knowing a band rocks or would you like all your mates to think they rock too?

I think the latter would make life a lot more fun.

You = Gay

 

[MasterOLightning]

You registered and made your first post just to say that?

 

[Thanatopsis123]

You = Gay

That's a solid first post.

 

[EVH316]

My Maiden-loving friend is on the money - the problem with popular bands is that, generally speaking, you need a certain sound to gain that popularity. And the sound required to do so is woeful. The most obvious example is Metallica. The songs on Load weren't bad songs but the sound ... well I may as well have been listening to Bush.

Although there are some out there who resent the success while ignoring the music, the reason most metal fans listen to bands with fewer fans is because the elements that make metal great just happen to diametrically oppose what is needed to be commercially successful.

In other words, the topic of this thread is really quite useless.

 

[VampyrRose]

I have no problem with bands being popular, just as long as they're popular for the right reasons. For example, i do listen to CoF and Dimmu Borgir. However, within recent years they're gradually becoming more and more commercial thus gaining popularity and seeping into the mainstream. I wouldn't call them sellouts by any means, I just think they are promoting themselves in the wrong way. Its obvious that the "image-first" way of promotion is sure to catch fire with young teens/children, and what follows is self explanatory. And as for other bands its as simple as making numerous appearances on MTV. But i don't think being commercial/mainstream necessarily makes the band less talented.

 

[Saparmurat_Niyazov]

My Maiden-loving friend is on the money - the problem with popular bands is that, generally speaking, you need a certain sound to gain that popularity. And the sound required to do so is woeful. The most obvious example is Metallica. The songs on Load weren't bad songs but the sound ... well I may as well have been listening to Bush.

Although there are some out there who resent the success while ignoring the music, the reason most metal fans listen to bands with fewer fans is because the elements that make metal great just happen to diametrically oppose what is needed to be commercially successful.

In other words, the topic of this thread is really quite useless.

Damn, you're good. You actually successfully elaborated on an already great post. You deserve a cookie.:Spin:

 

[Demiurge]

I've seen a lot on here of metalheads bitching about bands that are mainstream, such as Lamb Of God, one of my personal favourites. Simply saying :

"They're too mainstream, and that makes them shit"

It makes me sick when people bitch about bands becoming mainstream.

Often bands change their styles to become more appealing to popular music fans, thus losing their integrity. That is the basis for the complaint.

People start bands to make music and get famous, to put their music out and touch as many people as possible. That's what music is about, making a buck or two is a bonus and merely a result of our culture.

I'm sure most bands would still be just as happy if instead of getting money for their music they simply got everyone in the world who digged it to come up to them and say 'you rock, your music stirrs something inside of me, that makes me disconnect from the normal world' (that's how music makes me feel anyway), or words to that effect.

I doubt it, otherwise most popular musicians wouldn't throw hissy fits over royalties because 20 million dollars of annual income(or whatever it is) isn't enough for them. Music is sick trash these days because "artists" become involved with it for monetary rewards. Such people have little concern for quality, only for appealing to as many people as possible. These people have no vision. Their music is not an end, it is a means to coke binges.

Lamb Of God are pretty mainstream compaired to say Urban Nightmare or someone (who? you say, exactly.) but they are by no means as mainstream and popular as say Slayer, but I don't hear people bitching about Slayer 'selling out'.

I welcome you to our humble planet, Earth.

'm sure a lot of bands to sell out purposefully, a perfect example being Powerman 5000 who openly admit it but please people, try and understand the economics of :

Good music = fans = mainstreamness

This formula would lead me to believe that the best music is also the most popular, which I don't believe for the second. You're operating under the misconception the opinion of the lowest common denominator is somehow relevant to the quality of art. It isn't. If anything, the correlation between quality and popularity is a negative one. Britney Spears is popular, mainstream, but not "good" by any stretch of the imagination. She is not an example of an exception.

I'd like to hear a how man people would complain if say... (insert rather unknown metal band here) became mainstream and were in the billboard top 10.

I suppose there is the possibility that the masses could be showing a discerning taste for the first time in modern history, but barring that, said band, assuming it was of high quality at some point, has changed for the worse.

 

[ProjectedBlack]

When i hear LoG i think Dewscented straight up. (but I still like them, Dewscented is just better).

I 100% agree with this thread. People should spend more time listening than putting on a fucking show, "look at me, I'm dark I only listen to underground metal because I'm a 'true' metal head."
First on my list of bands stuck in this category is Dimmu Borgir. They're fucking awesome and people over look this because some dumbass along the lines compared them to Cradle of Filth (probably when they toured together). When i listen to Dimmu I hear more of an Emperor-esque sound.
Point being that everyone says they aren't true black metal "anymore". BULL SHIT! They are making the exact same music with the same symphonic infuenced black metal as always. the only thing that has changed is their production quality, and I really think the quality better fits their style (I like the new Stormblast much more).

Bottom line, pay attention to the music and quit putting so much effort into noncomforty. that's soooo totally not metal.

Mainstream bands that suck:
Dream Theatre (first on purpose)
Metallica
The Haunted
Children of Bodom
Cradle of Filth

There's no use arguing in favor of new Dimmu Borgir because I simply find your opinion that they are relatively the same band they've always been, incorrect. Stormblast is an album I really like, while not so much as some other bands, I like the mellow feeling of it, the piano work, the riffs, etc. I listened to Deathcult Armegeddon once and never listened to it again, they have COMPLETELY changed direction with their music and that is why many people who don't even listen to Metal can like them but not like any other Black Metal.