2013 - new and upcoming albums

[Postulate]

Late Sieges Even is shrinking on me. The writing and arrangements on Art of Navigating...are great, brilliant even, but Arno Menses isn't my favorite singer. He can be really twee and annoying at times. The latest two Subsignal albums, for example, I find really syrupy and obnoxious. The first one is pretty great, though. The title track of Paraíso is also great.

SE's best material was Steps & A Sense of Change

 

[The Stormbringer]

I had a whole response written up, and the forum ate it. Won't type it again, but here were the main points:

-FWX tracks like Simple Human, Stranger, and Crawl are lame and have nothing of the band's sound other than the fact that they're better musicians than the bands they're imitating
-Said tracks are clearly influenced by Deftones, Tool, etc.
-Lighthouse is awesome, it does build, just doesn't climax, shares many sensibilities with APSoG and Disconnected, just taken to an extreme, very tense despite being so gloomy
-Ray sounds great on this album, IMO best he's sounded in his career so far
-And Yet It Moves is a miracle of prog metal engineering
-O Chloroform is super cool

I second every notion here, except that I actually dig Simple Human for what it is.

Sieges Even's "The Art Of..." is an album I will never grow tired of, definitely one of the best progressive rock records of the last two decades. I used to worship "A Sense Of Change" like crazy, but "The Art Of..." and also "Paramount" blow it out of the water in almost every aspect if you ask me.

 

[Postulate]

I second every notion here, except that I actually dig Simple Human for what it is.

Sieges Even's "The Art Of..." is an album I will never grow tired of, definitely one of the best progressive rock records of the last two decades. I used to worship "A Sense Of Change" like crazy, but "The Art Of..." and also "Paramount" blow it out of the water in almost every aspect if you ask me.

Art of Navigating...is one of the most unique and well-written albums ever. I just wouldn't have chosen Arno Menses first to sing it.

 

[AsoTamaki]

Well, the new Ayreon is super lame. Lyrically, it's as eye-rolling as you'd expect. Some of the instrumental stuff sounds cool, but really the majority of the music comes off like transitional filler. There's maybe four or five developed shorter tracks that can be listened to individually. The album's definitely made to always be experienced in its entirety, but it's far too boring for that. The story has no depth and was not even compelling on the first listen. It would be like trying to RE-watch one of the Paranormal Activity sequels or something. Highly disappointing...

I had a whole response written up, and the forum ate it. Won't type it again, but here were the main points:

That sucks. Yeah, the forum was weird for a while and I didn't even see your response when I last posted. Always type up long posts in notepad or something, bro.

-FWX tracks like Simple Human, Stranger, and Crawl are lame and have nothing of the band's sound other than the fact that they're better musicians than the bands they're imitating
-Said tracks are clearly influenced by Deftones, Tool, etc.

Still don't hear any Deftones in that stuff. I actually was a big fan of White Pony/Around The Fur and it's a very different style both instrumentally and vocally. This is a Deftones influenced song:



"Stranger" was a bit out of left field (and the Tool influence is present in the verses), but the other two definitely continued along with the band's sound as heard on the first half of Disconnected ("Pieces of Me", etc.).

-O Chloroform is super cool

Yeah, it is. Maybe the best melodies on the album. Interesting lyrics too.

-Ray sounds great on this album, IMO best he's sounded in his career so far

Alright. He does still sound good, but...that's just going too far. I think you're officially high out of your mind right now. Sorry. It's that "new music" high where your senses are being exaggerated and everything tastes way better than it normally would. Let's pick this conversation back up in a year or so and see how we feel.

 

[Liampie]

I like the new Ayreon. I agree it sounds a bit boring and disjointed, but the more I listened the more I heard implicit and explicit reprises that bind the thing together for me. And trying to see the 42 tracks as 4 songs also helps. Lastly, personally I'm a huge fan of Tommy Karevik.

Definitely not up to par with Into the Electric Castle and The Human Equation, definitely not a masterpiece as some fans label it, but it's definitely an enjoyable album. If the album consisted of 'normal' songs, it would surpass 01011001 at least. This album has better hooks and a better guest lineup.

 

[Kenneth R.]

Ayreon is so dead bro.

 

[Postulate]

Alright. He does still sound good, but...that's just going too far. I think you're officially high out of your mind right now. Sorry. It's that "new music" high where your senses are being exaggerated and everything tastes way better than it normally would. Let's pick this conversation back up in a year or so and see how we feel.

No Exit and Perfect Symmetry Alder has a certain style - he's quite good, but I think generally inferior to Arch for the style of music the Fates were playing. They only really started making music tailored to him, where he could really shine, with Parallels. But there was always a quality in his voice I wasn't too fond of. That quality has slowly disappeared over the years, including in his time with Redemption, such that for me his voice has gotten progressively better over the years. Alder doesn't really need range so much as as he needs other qualities. His voice has gotten a bit more gravelly and handles the melodies much more smoothly. He is a better singer than he was before, although older.

Still don't hear any Deftones in that stuff. I actually was a big fan of White Pony/Around The Fur and it's a very different style both instrumentally and vocally. This is a Deftones influenced song:

I dunno, I hear the same sort of things as the Engine song. Anthemic chorus backed by crunchy alt-metal riffs, and a bit of roughness on the vocals (especially in Crawl). Of course, the songs on FWX also have a bassist and drummer that are miles and miles beyond Deftones', and a couple odd time sigs and things like that. Then there's Another Perfect Day, which is just...a fucking weird song.

 

[Postulate]

"Stranger" was a bit out of left field (and the Tool influence is present in the verses), but the other two definitely continued along with the band's sound as heard on the first half of Disconnected ("Pieces of Me", etc.).

Pieces of me also has a little bit of that "alt-metal" feel to it, but I like it because it has a clever "drop" and some very sweet rhythms, even in the vocals. it's the kind of music that I would imagine, for example, Disturbed making if they were really good.

 

[Liampie]

Anything Kenneth doesn't like is dead, naturally.

 

[Wander]

Anything Kenneth doesn't like is dead, naturally.

To Kenneth, naturally.

 

[Sauna]

^--- I dont think the expression works too well that way. To me, calling a band or an artist dead implies a claim at a somewhat "objective" stance for the criticism, like it's something beyond mere opinion. Saying a band sucks is not the same as saying a band is dead, at least to me.

And I can definitely see where Postulate is coming from with the stuff about Alder's vocals. He sounds different these days, but I enjoy a lot of the vocals on for example the Redemption albums more than the ones on the older Fates Warning records, despite his diminished range. There's a certain kind of severity that has crept into his voice with age.

 

[Phanto]

Alright so I've been listening to the new Ayreon for a bit now. 2-3 listens. I think it's among the most lyrically awful album I've heard.
Musically, it's fine. Even good at some points. Beside a couple of vocalists (one already discussed), I think most put out a good performance. Too bad the words they are sing are hilariously corny.

I mean, this isn't Arjen making "Ziltoid". He's trying to be serious-face about a story (which I'm not entirely grasping... a kid goes to a therapist? he's a wonder kid?). He really should get someone else to write lyrics for him.

 

[Postulate]

^--- I dont think the expression works too well that way. To me, calling a band or an artist dead implies a claim at a somewhat "objective" stance for the criticism, like it's something beyond mere opinion. Saying a band sucks is not the same as saying a band is dead, at least to me.

And I can definitely see where Postulate is coming from with the stuff about Alder's vocals. He sounds different these days, but I enjoy a lot of the vocals on for example the Redemption albums more than the ones on the older Fates Warning records, despite his diminished range. There's a certain kind of severity that has crept into his voice with age.

Severity is a good word. But it also has an unpretentiousness to it, so not "severe" in an affected way, and capable of warmth too. I also think he was gifted with a nice timbre. I love the vocal piece.

 

[Kenneth R.]

^--- I dont think the expression works too well that way. To me, calling a band or an artist dead implies a claim at a somewhat "objective" stance for the criticism, like it's something beyond mere opinion. Saying a band sucks is not the same as saying a band is dead, at least to me.

And I can definitely see where Postulate is coming from with the stuff about Alder's vocals. He sounds different these days, but I enjoy a lot of the vocals on for example the Redemption albums more than the ones on the older Fates Warning records, despite his diminished range. There's a certain kind of severity that has crept into his voice with age.

Dead is like the far end of the suck-spectrum. It's still opinion, obviously. It would be absurd for us to have to [disclaimer: the following post contains opinions!] every time.

Severity is a good word, I agree.

Arjen has the same problem as a bunch of fantasy-book readers who want to be authors. They understand the genre tropes, but they don't realize that to be successful you have to be subtle and have a deep command of language. Could it be that his first language not being English (?) is a factor in this? His lyrics are juvenile. I'm sure they aren't intentionally so.

 

[Phanto]

Arjen has the same problem as a bunch of fantasy-book readers who want to be authors. They understand the genre tropes, but they don't realize that to be successful you have to be subtle and have a deep command of language. Could it be that his first language not being English (?) is a factor in this? His lyrics are juvenile. I'm sure they aren't intentionally so.

I think that's spot on.

 

[Wander]

Yeah, I listened to some of the new Ayreon today.

I didn't bother much with the story, but there are just so many awkward moments lyrically. When I hear some guy sing "Yes, I'm a brilliant chemist" as exposition when an another character needs help in chemistry, I can't help but laugh out loud. it's just absolutely ludicrous. And the story is ridden with moments like these. Everything is explained through like the listener is a child.

And it's too long. Period. Musically I thought it started well, but it starts to just drones on and on and on. There is no way I can keep interest in this kind of music for 80 minutes in one sitting.

Some of the vocalists are certainly quality. But that's to be expected. The lines put in their mouth are just so awkward that they can't show their best.

You just can't take it seriously. If this was a film, you could at least watch it with friends and laugh at the cheesiness, but in music this "it's so bad it's funny/entertaining" thing doesn't quite work as well.

 

[Krondor]

I haven't listened the new Ayreon (actually now that I think of it, I haven't paid much attention to Ayren lyrics in general) but do lyrics always have to be complex? I'm all for lyrics that go a little deeper, but then again do the lyrics always have to be poetry?

 

[Liquid Tension]

If anyone wants to listen to the new Ayreon you can here....

http://www.progstreaming.com/_wb/index.php

 

[UnholyCrusada]

I haven't listened the new Ayreon (actually now that I think of it, I haven't paid much attention to Ayren lyrics in general) but do lyrics always have to be complex? I'm all for lyrics that go a little deeper, but then again do the lyrics always have to be poetry?

I mostly agree with this sentiment, at least when it comes to standalone tracks. Sure, well-penned lyrics can certainly help a song, but by no means do I think they should be the primary focus. As long as the music is well-written and performed solidly, the band can sing about just about anything for all I care. If the lyrics are really that poorly worded that it interferes with one's enjoyment of the album, then sure, subtract a few points from the score, but I personally think the music itself should take precedence in this regard.

That said, in this case the issue is that this particular album is supposed to be based around a concept, in which case lyrical content is substantially more important to the final product, being what binds all the tracks together into one cohesive whole. And of course, it's a general rule of thumb that if you're trying to write something with an overly epic or grand scale/atmosphere to it, then it does definitely matter that the subject matter and general wording complements the style of music.

For the record, I haven't listened to the new Ayreon album. I'm just basing this on my own prior experiences and my personal beliefs when it comes to this matter.

 

[Sauna]

Lyrics are a huge part of any song that has them. Any subject is fine as long as you can make it work, and they don't always have to be deep. They just have to be good in any of the endless ways in which lyrics can be good. Terrible lyrics can destroy an otherwise good song.