In Flames New Album being released in Q2 of 2014 thread

[Jester Slave]

The main problem is that, if they do a greatest hits dvd, they should be doing, apart from TTL, the Come Clarity song, which means another ballad. So I don't think they'll be ading another song from that album. Also, when you see peoples comments about what songs to play live, there is a lot of people who asks for Crawl Through Knives, but, the problem is that I don't think that Anders can sing this song live as his voice is now.

I'd consider Leeches as well.

As for choosing a better song than Resin, you have to remember these pre R2R songs have been released as official live material from the band:
Embody The Invisible (video+audio)
Bullet Ride (audio)
Jotun (video+audio)
Food For The Gods (vide+audio)
Moonshield (video+audio)
Clayman (video+audio
Swim (audio)
Behind Space (video+audio)
OFTW (v+a)
Gyroscope (a)
Scorn (a)
ORDINARY STORY (mah boy; audio)
Pinball Map (a+v)
Colony (a+v)
Episode 666 (a+v)

Now, exclude every song which are both on The Tokyo Showdown and Used and Abused. You have four albums with 0 songs having official audioboard and/or video about it performed live and you also have a slightly different fanbase. Now, to avoid another debate, let's just say there is overall a bigger need for the new material.
What do we get then? A bunch of older songs you guys said would be awesome live even today, so if we assume they are going to record this tour, it might explain why the hate. I mean, they would never do 35/65 ratio, but having ONE song from pre 2000 (or 2 from pre 2002 if it sounds even more extreme to you) is more than strange, though checking further in last year's setlist, it's not like they were much more generous with the older material.

STYE having 0 playtime is also strange; fans of Colony are treated better than the fans of STYE, which is something worth wrapping your head around. Even if they are going to shoot live material, at least one of the two most famous songs from the record could be played, but nope.

I think even if they will indeed shoot somel ive material, it does not justify the setlist and it's rigidity. Shouldn't you test your waters first, then by the time of december you'd know what songs you should keep playing from the new album. Also, having let's say 6 extra songs which come and go in the setlist would not just be most welcomed by fans who attend more shows, but by the time they are recording the show, they could just add those 6 songs to the setlist (so 25 songs overall) and record it that way, so even if you can't pull out 25 songs long sets from one day after another (for various reasons), you could surely do it once, and then every song you wished to present in its' live form could be released.

And about rigidity, I could understand they want to get warmed up with the new songs, but half of the set have been performed a million times, it's not like Björn will forget the solo for TTL or something like that.

So yeah, my conclusion is that the only effect of a possible live shooting is the lack of STYE songs and why they might've chosen Resin over songs like Jotun/Colony/Embody.

edit: also, playing more old songs for the sake of a live album would be pretentious as well. "Hey, buy or newest live dvd with 7 songs from pre 2002!!!", then at every other show they will just still play Resin, because for some reason they just don't want to play more. Umm, yeah, all I meant with this is that the lack of older songs doesn't mean they won't shoot live material, though I don't think anyone have stated the opposite

 

[DE4life]

It got too crazy really fast and I had no time to read through it all.

You'd need a few hours to read all of Jester Slave's essays to be fair all I can say is that you really didn't miss much, except me handing him a textual beatdown.

 

[Jester Slave]

You do nothing but repeating the same mantra over and over again. I'm tired of this conversation.

All right, let's try it from a different approach. You might don't give a single shit about NIN, but I hope we can agree that Trent Reznor is a successfull artist and composer, who has been making music since the end of 1980s, so he should know a thing or another about how music is done or played live. He's honest as well, and not just gives vague answers like when Anders and co. saying something just doesn't work, and you either believe it or not.

About live performances:
Q: How did you decide what songs would make the cut for the set list?
A: [...] I've attended many concerts where I felt let down and I was wishing it would be something else. Not that it's their duty to please me, but at the same time I think a lot about what it's like through the eyes of the consumer, the fan. I want not to pander to the audience, but to be aware of them.

Haha, I like how I struggled to explain "pleasing fans live, but nor totally pleasing them", when I just had to use the expression being aware of. I think it says everything, and no, I don't think IF is aware of the fans, but only4theweak's exaggerated numbers are way off as well. Hint to myself: probably that's why they are exaggerated.

About criticizm in social media:
A: [...] Music and art can be damaged severely by too much information; I say that as somebody that has participated in that.
Q: Is that why you pulled back from Twitter?
A: That's the main reason, yeah. I was experimenting with it when I was on tour and in search of constant stimulus. People saw "Oh, he might have a sense of humor and he's not living in a coffin." That didn't fit into the mold of what either the press or myself had built up over the years. But Twitter, more than any other form of social media, can be at its most destructive when you're paying too much attention to what people are saying. Lots of people say, "I don't read reviews." I've said that and I've been lying through my teeth, because I can't wait to read every fucking word. But in the last few years, I've stopped reading all of it. There's power in just shutting down -- there's too much information in the world. This culture we live in, whether it's Instagramming your salad or putting out a sex tape, it's kind of vulgar.

Yeah, if I were the edition of Anders Fridén who reads every single post on facebook and boards like this about people's opinion about me and my music, I'd probably drink myself to death everyday. Even if 80% of the posts ranges from positive to very positive, imagine reading all the shit talk. It doesn't help you at all in your direction of music, because other people are stating the exact opposite, but you lose faith in yourself and won't dare to do anything. "Ooh, I had not done this before! It would be so awe... oh wait, but what if I get shit for this too? Yeah, maybe I shouldn't..."
I don't think people realize that in a case of any band who ever done anything out of the ordinary (eg not the same receipt for every single album), it's impossible to make a new material which makes every fan go "HELL YEAH 10/10, BEST SHIT EVER!", thus you would be stupid to try it in the first place.
And it's not like the world stops if they make a "shit" record. A lot of you hate ASOP but like SOAPF, and here I am the other way around. Someone might hate both but digs SC a lot. Maybe there are some ungodly human beings who would say their favourite IF albums are Colony and SC.

About makin new material:
Q: On the other end of the transaction, what do you think people want out of Nine Inch Nails at this point?
A: That's a good question -- I don't know. What I'm trying to do is be as pure as when I started. In the process of writing those first songs I realized that the only thing I can do well is express who I am truthfully. That has the most power. When I return to the writing process after being away from it for a while, the first part of it always is being honest with myself: What am I into right now? [...] And secondly, when it comes time to put pen to paper and express feelings, who am I right now? What do I, as a forty-seven or forty-eight-year-old man, have to say about anything? It takes time to rediscover that -- in my day-to-day normal life I tend to not sit down and really think about how I feel. I'm not in therapy or in an AA meeting.

But my favourite quote (highlighted) regarding making new material is from an interview snipper back in 1994 (the previous snippets are from 2013):
Q: Do you think some of those cool fans will be disappointed or feel a little bit betrayed?
A: I can't even begin to answer that. When I was recording this I started to think, Are people going to like this? It's just a creative trap to fall into. The person that liked that one thing I did before is there enough of that on this record? What I'm guessing they liked in the first place.
Q: Like you were saying with Head Like A Hole.
A: Same exact thing. The other records I did were because that's what I wanted to do. In hindsight, I think that this is a record that doesn't have any real singles on it. I don't really see any of these songs being a big MTV video song. I really don't hear it as that type of a record. I'm sure there will be people that don't like this record just as I'm not so sure that there will be people that do like this record. I like it and that's all I can do. It will be interesting to see what happens.

 

[Jester Slave]

You'd need a few hours to read all of Jester Slave's essays to be fair all I can say is that you really didn't miss much, except me handing him a textual beatdown.

You did not hand me anything, I called you a retard and you called me a retard.

 

[eochaid]

Such long posts... I'm not reading them and I don't care about Trendt Reznor (as if he is the only recognized or succesful musician in the world).

As for the dvd reasoning. No one is saying nothing about it having a bunch of old songs (starting that its future existance is a krofius suspiction). And de have oftw played three times in two different live releases and stye has its own special presence in UAA.

 

[Jester Slave]

Such long posts... I'm not reading them and I don't care about Trendt Reznor (as if he is the only recognized or succesful musician in the world).

Then I'm happy you know being a musician better than a musician.

It was a pleasure debating with you: "c'mon gimme reasons. c'mon, look, I'm even condescending to you, showing you how right I am! Don't just repeat yourself! Oh, wait, are you sharing an actual musician's thought on the matter? No thanks, too long, won't read lalalala, if I don't read it it does not exists lalala, I know it better anyway, I played like 400 shows and made 10 albums, I know how it works"

OK. And you were handing out 0s for logic...

 

[Jester Slave]

Bored at work so I was reading the Watch Them Feed thread. From 2003. 11 years ago. Kinda scary that if you hide the posters names, avatars and sigs, and change R2R up with SC and Watch Them Feed with a song on SC, you couldn't tell the difference between this thread and that one.

R2R is shitty
R2R is brilliant
you're a fanboy
you don't know what a fanboy is
your taste sucks
you're an ass
anders stop singing (! )
you want good if songs? listen to ls, tjr or whoracle
you people live in the past

Maybe being an In Flames fan is being at each other's throat for an eternity. I even found our friend, UC there. What a veteran!

 

[eochaid]

Then I'm happy you know being a musician better than a musician.

It was a pleasure debating with you: "c'mon gimme reasons. c'mon, look, I'm even condescending to you, showing you how right I am! Don't just repeat yourself! Oh, wait, are you sharing an actual musician's thought on the matter? No thanks, too long, won't read lalalala, if I don't read it it does not exists lalala, I know it better anyway, I played like 400 shows and made 10 albums, I know how it works"

OK. And you were handing out 0s for logic...

Sorry but I don't understand what you're saying. You're posting a musician thoughts about music. Good. There are hundred of succesful musicians out there and eveyone has it's own way to aproach music.

Speaking through others is not giving reasons, it's just giving other people reasons. And no, I won't read such long posts.

 

[shad0w__]

Bored at work so I was reading the Watch Them Feed thread. From 2003. 11 years ago. Kinda scary that if you hide the posters names, avatars and sigs, and change R2R up with SC and Watch Them Feed with a song on SC, you couldn't tell the difference between this thread and that one.

R2R is shitty
R2R is brilliant
you're a fanboy
you don't know what a fanboy is
your taste sucks
you're an ass
anders stop singing (! )
you want good if songs? listen to ls, tjr or whoracle
you people live in the past

Maybe being an In Flames fan is being at each other's throat for an eternity. I even found our friend, UC there. What a veteran!

Lol this is great. People never learn

 

[eochaid]

Bored at work so I was reading the Watch Them Feed thread. From 2003. 11 years ago. Kinda scary that if you hide the posters names, avatars and sigs, and change R2R up with SC and Watch Them Feed with a song on SC, you couldn't tell the difference between this thread and that one.

R2R is shitty
R2R is brilliant
you're a fanboy
you don't know what a fanboy is
your taste sucks
you're an ass
anders stop singing (! )
you want good if songs? listen to ls, tjr or whoracle
you people live in the past

Maybe being an In Flames fan is being at each other's throat for an eternity. I even found our friend, UC there. What a veteran!

No, please, enlighten us with the posters' names so we can know who is contradicting himself.

 

[Jester Slave]

Sorry but I don't understand what you're saying. You're posting a musician thoughts about music. Good. There are hundred of succesful musicians out there and eveyone has it's own way to aproach music.

Speaking through others is not giving reasons, it's just giving other people reasons. And no, I won't read such long posts.

Aren't we arguing about musicians pleasing or not pleasing the fans? I gave you (and myself, since it's not entirely what I've been saying) a perspective on the matter. If you don'T think he's right then explain why, if you know other musician with different approach, bring up him/them as a counter-arguement.

You don't have to read it but it doesn't mean it's not there, and frankly, I rate (accomplished) musician's opinion or thoughts on this matter a thousand times more appropriate than you or me saying "I think..." while we are talking about a not so black and white topic. 1+1=2 is easy, but you won't find any rules telling artists how should they behave, compose, interact. It's a whole new world, and you and me arguing on a tiny island just doesn't really worth much, unless we had some experience in the matter as well.

 

[eochaid]

Aren't we arguing about musicians pleasing or not pleasing the fans? I gave you (and myself, since it's not entirely what I've been saying) a perspective on the matter. If you don'T think he's right then explain why, if you know other musician with different approach, bring up him/them as a counter-arguement.

You don't have to read it but it doesn't mean it's not there, and frankly, I rate (accomplished) musician's opinion or thoughts on this matter a thousand times more appropriate than you or me saying "I think..." while we are talking about a not so black and white topic. 1+1=2 is easy, but you won't find any rules telling artists how should they behave, compose, interact. It's a whole new world, and you and me arguing on a tiny island just doesn't really worth much, unless we had some experience in the matter as well.

Do you think there's a right or wrong about aproaching music? Good for you. And if your "right" is the same as some artist even better for you. And, no, you only rate opinions from artists that fit your own opinions, or, even worse, you make your opinions from other people thoughts.

if you know other musician with different approach, bring up him/them as a counter-arguement

No, I won't do this because is stupid. If you think that this man's words are God's law then it's your problem, not mine.

I'm not arguing about how anybody aproaches their fans or music, I'm just stating evident contradictions.

And remember, we mortals are not as music wise as you the followers of this so incredibly indescriptable enormous great magnificient superb band that is NIN.

 

[DE4life]

R2R as a whole was a very divisive album, much like SC. Of course there are going to be similar themes in the respective threads, you'd have to be stupid to expect anything different.

The SOAPF thread on the other hand will be quite different, on the basis it was a good album that most of us on here liked.

 

[eochaid]

You think so because you have a mind limited by the bounds of a mortal body. Or maybe is a vague argument to show how stupid we are for not liking SC changes.

 

[Jester Slave]

Do you think there's a right or wrong about aproaching music? Good for you. And if your "right" is the same as some artist even better for you. And, no, you only rate opinions from artists that fit your own opinions, or, even worse, you make your opinions from other people thoughts.



No, I won't do this because is stupid. If you think that this man's words are God's law then it's your problem, not mine.

I'm not arguing about how anybody aproaches their fans or music, I'm just stating evident contradictions.

And remember, we mortals are not as music wise as you the followers of this so incredibly indescriptable enormous great magnificient superb band that is NIN.

See, you can be just as a whiny bitch as I am. Where did I say it is the law when I quoted him? You are playing the victim for no reason at all. Of course he is my go-to guy if I want to give an example from the music world because it's his shit I know in and out, it's his interviews I read from top to bottom. It doesn't matter if he is right or wrong - yes, I do think there is right or wrong, surf in today's music and you will find plenty of wrong -, it's just an imput to (using your own words) stimulate you, something for you to think about and/or react to. You might think "man, I think now I understand!", but you might also say "bullshit, it's still contradictory because of this and that". Getting this defensive from an opinion you are not even willing to read is just uncalled for and silly.

My opinion was my own, but since it appeared so that I struggled to make my point come across to you, I searched for something which explains what I was talking about much much better and clearer. You keep saying your problem is with contradictions and that's what my quoted interview snippets meant to clear up a bit, because you seem to be at a loss with understanding the difference between what goes on in an artist's mind when creating music and what when he selects songs to play live - mainly because you dumbed the topic down to that they either please the fans or not, nothing in between that is possible.
As for the social media part, I just found it awfully relevant for IF as well, but I did not search for it, it was just in the same interview, so why not share it.

 

[eochaid]

See, you can be just as a whiny bitch as I am. Where did I say it is the law when I quoted him? You are playing the victim for no reason at all. Of course he is my go-to guy if I want to give an example from the music world because it's his shit I know in and out, it's his interviews I read from top to bottom. It doesn't matter if he is right or wrong - yes, I do think there is right or wrong, surf in today's music and you will find plenty of wrong -, it's just an imput to (using your own words) stimulate you, something for you to think about and/or react to. You might think "man, I think now I understand!", but you might also say "bullshit, it's still contradictory because of this and that". Getting this defensive from an opinion you are not even willing to read is just uncalled for and silly.

My opinion was my own, but since it appeared so that I struggled to make my point come across to you, I searched for something which explains what I was talking about much much better and clearer. You keep saying your problem is with contradictions and that's what my quoted interview snippets meant to clear up a bit, because you seem to be at a loss with understanding the difference between what goes on in an artist's mind when creating music and what when he selects songs to play live - mainly because you dumbed the topic down to that they either please the fans or not, nothing in between that is possible.
As for the social media part, I just found it awfully relevant for IF as well, but I did not search for it, it was just in the same interview, so why not share it.

To say it clearly, do you know this thread is about IF, do you?

So, I will talk about their words, not about any other words. Maybe he explains really well whatever he wants to explain. So what? Are his words inmediately applied on IF words to explain them? Do you think so? Good.

You seem to be at a loss with understanding the difference between what goes on in an artist's mind when creating music and what when he selects songs to play live

Well, you seem a bit loss with distinguishing between different artists and their motivations. I'm not taking some IF words and making a thesis out of them, I'm taking their own words and explaining why they seem contradictory.

 

[eochaid]

Though, it's good to see you so motivated about the question, cause everytime you feel you're loosing on an argument you simply do as if it doesn't exist anymore.

 

[Jester313]

You'd need a few hours to read all of Jester Slave's essays to be fair all I can say is that you really didn't miss much, except me handing him a textual beatdown.

A beatdown? Damn. Can you re-post it? Also, can we get those two their own thread?

 

[eochaid]

A beatdown? Damn. Can you re-post it? Also, can we get those two their own thread?

Thank you very much for talking about me without naming me. It's very polite.

 

[Jester Slave]

R2R as a whole was a very divisive album, much like SC. Of course there are going to be similar themes in the respective threads, you'd have to be stupid to expect anything different.

The SOAPF thread on the other hand will be quite different, on the basis it was a good album that most of us on here liked.

Sure, but R2R was the first and biggest hit to "traditional" IF fans, so some of the doomsday reactions can be explained with it. But some of the posts here acted like it was unbelievable from IF to release an album like SC.

Howewer, that's really not the main problem, but the way older material lovers kept throwing around "you are not a true fan" "you're a fanboy if you like this shit", while bowing down to the old material like it's some holy creation. What, you don't like Whoracle? PIECE OF SHIT. You don't like R2R? Nice, your musical taste is top notch. etc etc etc

There was even a guy who acted just the same as UC doing now. Back then UC must've been a youngster because his only post was one where innocently asked if WTF will be featured on the new album or not. That stefan guy must've been his mentor, because he become the same dickhead (if not worse, at least stefan apparently gave up on IF), provoking the ones who like the newer stuff in almost all of his posts. Really, all of that stefan's post is about "of course it's shit mate, it's on R2R, lololololol".

It's 2014 and you can be still barked at for saying you find Ordinary Story boring.

You think so because you have a mind limited by the bounds of a mortal body. Or maybe is a vague argument to show how stupid we are for not liking SC changes.

Wow, I created a monster!

To say it clearly, do you know this thread is about IF, do you?

So, I will talk about their words, not about any other words. Maybe he explains really well whatever he wants to explain. So what? Are his words inmediately applied on IF words to explain them? Do you think so? Good.



Well, you seem a bit loss with distinguishing between different artists and their motivations. I'm not taking some IF words and making a thesis out of them, I'm taking their own words and explaining why they seem contradictory.

Holy shit man, do you know IF is not the only band in the world which makes new albums and go on tours?
The arguement is about an artistic question/contradiction, so news flash, other artists opinion are indeed relevant. Trust me, if Anders was more talkative about this matter, I would've quoted him.

And once again, I just presented you an example, but you keep giving a tantrum about it, because the voices in your head are telling you that I think that guy = IF.

Though, it's good to see you so motivated about the question, cause everytime you feel you're loosing on an argument you simply do as if it doesn't exist anymore.

Haha, how dare you talk about losing an arguement and pretending something doesn't exist, when it's like your 5th post since you just put your hands up in the air and refused to read what I'm writing to you.

Which would be perfectly fine, you don't have to, but why are you keep arguing about something if you are not even reading the responses, lol? Drop it already, and pretend you know more about music than an artist. And don't give me the NIN-qq again, because if I were to quote from John Lennon himself saying the exact same thing you'd be like "OMG BUT HE IS NOT IN FLAMES, SO MY OPINION > JOHN LENNON". Though I'm lying, you wouldn't read that either.

A beatdown? Damn. Can you re-post it? Also, can we get those two their own thread?

And a bed please.