In Flames New Album being released in Q2 of 2014 thread

And also I don't really get the part where if you can't perform some vocals 100% identical to how you did it on the album, all of a sudden it sucks.

Of course bands want it to sound as good as possible on album, what do you want them to do, record songs in a one-time live take? Of course he's gonna try to do the best he can on the albums, and if he feels like screaming the choruses live instead of doing cleans like on the album, then what is the problem with that lol? Many bands change small parts when they perform them live, even changing parts of songs, especially vocalists, and in Metal. I think there's much more spontaneity when it comes to Metal vocalists live, doing longer screams, growling etc, however they feel at the moment. That's what I love about Anders live, he randomly shoots in death growls and screams at different parts of different songs on different shows. Variety.

I mean, who are anyone of us to say how the songs SHOULD sound or be performed live? They made the songs, if he thinks it sounds better or he just rather feels like screaming live on parts, no one can argue against that in any way.

We're not talking about Whitney Houston here where you have to land every note to perfection, it's metal music, it's not meant to be cookie-cutter perfect.

Maybe it's just me but I don't really care if bands I listen to doesn't sound the same as on the albums, as long as I think they sound good live. Anders failing to hit some cleans live or some other vocalist can't simulate clean singing choruses perfect, and chooses to scream instead for example, doesn't bother me in the slightest. Would be much more of a catastrophe if the drummer started playing out of rhythm or guitarists fucking up badly. Vocals in Metal in my eyes has always been more of a complimentent to the instrumentals.

Don't even know what my point was to begin with but TL DR:

Everything doesn't have to be perfect sounding, especially live. I mean come on, it's live metal music, the central part of the show you're at should be the feeling and the energy, not a few vocal lines lol.
 
Hm, happy to see this vocal bullshit met with proper and sane opposition. I'm fine with the SC/ASOP/whateverelse hate, but this vocal shit in the last few pages....

Anyway, have you guys checked back on the Rusted Nail video? The last time I watched it (maybe a month into SC release? possibly a bit more) it had quite poor views, but more importantly, it had around 60-65% upvotes, which is pretty shit. Well, now that they toured the shit out of themselves and basically promoted the album and the song as well, it's closing in on 2m views and with a 90%+ upvote ratio. Yaaay!
 
Still touching yourself while talking about the band? This is no good. Your balls must be boiling by now.
 
krofius said:
And also I don't really get the part where if you can't perform some vocals 100% identical to how you did it on the album, all of a sudden it sucks.

Of course bands want it to sound as good as possible on album, what do you want them to do, record songs in a one-time live take? Of course he's gonna try to do the best he can on the albums, and if he feels like screaming the choruses live instead of doing cleans like on the album, then what is the problem with that lol? Many bands change small parts when they perform them live, even changing parts of songs, especially vocalists, and in Metal. I think there's much more spontaneity when it comes to Metal vocalists live, doing longer screams, growling etc, however they feel at the moment. That's what I love about Anders live, he randomly shoots in death growls and screams at different parts of different songs on different shows. Variety.

I mean, who are anyone of us to say how the songs SHOULD sound or be performed live? They made the songs, if he thinks it sounds better or he just rather feels like screaming live on parts, no one can argue against that in any way.

We're not talking about Whitney Houston here where you have to land every note to perfection, it's metal music, it's not meant to be cookie-cutter perfect.

Maybe it's just me but I don't really care if bands I listen to doesn't sound the same as on the albums, as long as I think they sound good live. Anders failing to hit some cleans live or some other vocalist can't simulate clean singing choruses perfect, and chooses to scream instead for example, doesn't bother me in the slightest. Would be much more of a catastrophe if the drummer started playing out of rhythm or guitarists fucking up badly. Vocals in Metal in my eyes has always been more of a complimentent to the instrumentals.

Don't even know what my point was to begin with but TL DR:

Everything doesn't have to be perfect sounding, especially live. I mean come on, it's live metal music, the central part of the show you're at should be the feeling and the energy, not a few vocal lines lol.
Click to expand...

LOL!

The lengths you go to excuse shitty vocal performances.

Let's imagine Bjorn pulling off Jeff Loomis in studio with the help of dozen other guitarists, all studio tools available and million takes. Then he goes out on stage playing 5 basic chords, out of tune, missing whole parts of the song, while backing track covers the holes.

That's how Anders does his "magic".

Apology to Loomis for comparing his guitar work with whiny pseudo-singing Anders does in studio.
 
Dear all,

Anders is not a good singer as he never trains, as you can hear on the acoustic version of Dead Eyes. Please note that this is a very simple fact.

IN FLAMES live shows would be way more awesome if Anders could sing properly. Please note that this is a very simple fact too.

I don't need 3000 words to get to my point as my point is very, very simple.

Thank you.

I'm not here to discuss if this is a very serious issue or not. I'm just pointing out at these two very simple facts.
 
Your opinion is a fact? If he could sing the shows WOULD be better, because according to you, the song is better if he sings, like he ''SHOULD'', right?
Your definition of a good show isn't some global fact PlainVanilla. If he wanted to 100% scream on all songs, it has nothing to do with how much more awesome the shows would be, except for your opinion how it SHOULD sound if it properly. They don't need to perform the songs the same. I do respect your opinion though, and I agree he can't pull of the same cleans live as on the album. Many of the songs has slight changes live, even newer material, such as The Mirror's Truth. They also did some stuff with The Hive, Episode 666 as well. And about that acoustic version I already said it sucked. But when he said he doesn't train the vocals, didn't he say that back on the ASOP studio diaries? I haven't heard him say it the last couple years. And obviously he has to practice or train it somehow or he wouldn't improve at all. But yeah I don't think he warms up his vocals and techniques pre-show like a lot of vocalists do. And this is a forum, which is where you discuss things, it's not a guestbook dude.

And A88 I'm not defending bad vocals, I say that it doesn't really matter to me if he doesn't perform the songs the same as the studio version, and if he struggles with doing the cleans live and decides to scream instead it also doesn't bother me. Vocals in metal in general for me is complimentary, often. It sure can add a lot to the music with good lyrics along with it. But live metal shows, I rather have it more aggressive with more energy personally.

I mean it is Anders actual vocals on the albums, it's not autotune or whatever, maybe he has to do 15 takes to get it ''good'' and if it does sound good in the end is also subjective. If he can't replicate it live like on the albums it doesn't matter to me, regardless of what band it is. I don't really know many metal vocalists that can pull off the clean melodies the same as the albums. The whole point of recording an album is to write the best stuff you can at the moment (for most bands), it's not meant to be ''this is how we sound live''. And nice hyperbole about Björn comparison. They already done that before, it's called The Jester Race and Whoracle, lol. At least according to themselves. I mean even Björn Strid who in my opinion is probably the best vocalist in metal music doesn't use the same techniques as on the albums and doesn't sing the same melodies on all songs, although he does sound awesome all the time.

And in my opinion, it's only on SC he can't replicate it the same live since it features a lot more singing. on R2R, STYE, CC, ASOP & even SOAPF I think it transferred much better. But lets be real, most of you thought SC sucked to begin with, so regardless if Anders pulled of the cleans perfectly or if he struggles with them, you would still think it sucks. I haven't seen anyone here ever complaining about In Flames not playing the December Flower Solo cause they were to bad to play it and removed it when they played it live.

eochaid said:
And still you defend an album on which music is a mere background to the vocals.
Click to expand...
Didn't think we were strictly talking about SC songs played live. And since I think it's their worst album released so far I wouldn't say I defend the album. Probably don't think it's just as bad as you think though. There are some good catchy riffs and melodies, some good vocals as well. Still really like Paralyzed, In Plain View, The Chase & Become the Sky, which IMO is also the 4 songs with the best and interesting guitar work.
 
krofius said:
Your opinion is a fact? If he could sing the shows WOULD be better, because according to you, the song is better if he sings, like he ''SHOULD'', right?
Click to expand...

STOP. YOUR. BULLSHIT.

I couldn't even read further.

Did I say that the shows would be better it he sang like he "SHOULD"?

No. Thank you, you lost your time writing bullshit stuff about something I didn't say and that I didn't even read because it was sooo irelevant.

It was very, very simple, written in FUCKING BIG RED LETTERS. You didn't get it ? Read it again.

He can't sing. HE CAN'T. All that comes from his mouth are false notes. Yes, false notes. It wouldn't be a problem to sing the songs differently if it was done properly but HE CAN'T because (shit, I just said it), all that comes from his mouth are false notes.

FALSE.

And when notes are FALSE it's beyond opinion. We entered the FACT world a while ago now.

Thank you for your attention. And please, read it twice, three times, I don't give a shit about how many times you need but please just get my point because it's fucking fact and clear. He can't sing and he should train to do so. I don't give a shit if the song is sung the same way it is on the album or differently, as long as the notes are fucking right.

Got it?

Fuck no, read it again.
 
Vanilla, allow me to skip talking about Anders being a good or a bad singer, and let me propose a question for you. Do you honestly think In Flames would attract more people if you put a generic good metal singer in Anders' position? Put your hand on your chest, maybe even load the 60mins long of proshot Hellfest footage and tell me.

My answer is a huge "no". First of all, he has a very characteristic voice. False or not, good or bad, doesn't matter, you know it's him. Like it or not, IF became what it is today in the music world when Anders actually tried to do his thing instead of being just a puppet singer. Maybe he killed In Flames the melodic death-metal band, but he helped made In Flames, the preeetty popular metal band. It's quite clear for me, that after all these records (counting from R2R) the people who go to an IF show or buy IF merchandise do not expect a singer who will hit every note and will sing all the songs just like their album version.
Also, the majority of their songs do not require perfect voice, and this is the reason they did not go bankrupt as soon as Anders started experimenting his voice. When someone literally can't sing, then he justscares away everyone from the live shows, because who would pay money to listen to something which hurts to listen to? Let's be real. Most of Anders' work pre-SOAPF is a mix of high energy and emotions. I never said to myself "man, his voice is so beautiful on Take This Life". As long as he can convey his energies and emotions to those songs, they will sound good live, like it or not. As for SOAPF, he does a lot of "talk-singing" or what the hell is it called, which sounds pretty easy, hell, it's not even singing. The hardest songs, in terms of requiring good vocals are funnily enough on Siren Charms. You can't half-ass Through Oblivion, With Eyes Wide Open or Dead Eyes as they are all very vocal centric. But as Krofius said, you guys pretty much hate every non-bonus track on SC, so Anders sucking ass on those songs shouldn't be concerning you. The biggest weakness of SC isn't even Anders voice, but the lack of instrumental experimenting.

It is so binary to think you need to be Taylor Swift to be considered good. Oh, by the way, did you guys ever hear Ellie Goulding live? She sounds like an angel on her studio works but I'm pretty sure she could do some mean growls on metal songs if she wanted to with her interestingly low voice during her live performances.

Anyway, music is a product, and is made up from many many things. If you think hitting every note is what needed to be successful, then watch any talent show, and see how amazing, perfect singers get voted out and forgotten as fast as they do. You need to sell your product, and Anders Fridén is great selling point for IF. Maybe it's an anomaly, maybe he was lucky to be at the right place at the right time and still riding that lucky wave, I don't know man, I'm not Rick Rubin to know what is needed exactly to make a band and songs which will headline festivals for decades, but it is what it is. Whether he sucks ass or doing just fine, people still want him. I mean, people minus the grumpy guys here.
 
krofius said:
Didn't think we were strictly talking about SC songs played live. And since I think it's their worst album released so far I wouldn't say I defend the album. Probably don't think it's just as bad as you think though. There are some good catchy riffs and melodies, some good vocals as well. Still really like Paralyzed, In Plain View, The Chase & Become the Sky, which IMO is also the 4 songs with the best and interesting guitar work.
Click to expand...

That's the first time I read you saying something "not good" about SC (jesterslave must be shaking now). Just kidding. No, I was referring to your words that vocals are a complement to the music in metal. And I think we all can agree that the main "instrument" in SC is Anders vocals.
 
You guys are fucking mental.

Did I talk about replacing Anders? Or did I talk about him working the shit out of his crappy singing?

Thank you. Have a wonderful evening.
 
I don't think one person here even attempted to argue that someone should replace Anders

PlainVanilla made an obvious point and I think all of us can agree to that simple fact.

In Flames live are one of the best bands on the planet. A talented group of musicians that just have a spark that is very rare. The music itself is always on point and sounds great. Anders screams/abrupt impromptu growls are both iconic as well as just really great(when he's not sick or his vocal cords strained).

PlainVanilla is just stating the fact that if Anders trained his singing voice they could be even more of an awesome show live. It would just add to the already epic-ness.

Found this. Video is shit, sound is good enough:



Interesting they played this song even in '08. As far as the cleans in the verses go for this song, there's no way even Anders could replicate the studio version as on the album he's talking very low & whispering at times.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
only4theweak187 said:
In Flames live are one of the best bands on the planet. A talented group of musicians that just have a spark that is very rare. The music itself is always on point and sounds great. Anders screams/abrupt impromptu growls are both iconic as well as just really great(when he's not sick or his vocal cords strained).
Click to expand...

I have to strongly disagree. They're a good band, but they are far from being one of the best bands live.
 
eochaid said:
That's the first time I read you saying something "not good" about SC (jesterslave must be shaking now). Just kidding. No, I was referring to your words that vocals are a complement to the music in metal. And I think we all can agree that the main "instrument" in SC is Anders vocals.
Click to expand...

Yeah the vocals are more upfront in SC but there's still a bunch of cool riffs. My favorite part on the album is probably the guitars after 2nd solo in ''In Plain View'' when he sings ''All the lights''. The chorus lead guitar melody is also great, it reminds me of Bullet Rides chorus melody a bit, not the actual melody but the construction of it behind the vocals. But I don't really listen to SC, basically only listening to Paralyzed weekly. Not listening that much specifically to IF either lately, got lots of songs in a big shuffle list that pops up though. Been gotten into new bands and artists lately.

And the newest Night Flight Orchestra album is indeed awesome. So fucking pumped for new Soilwork as well. Only 2 months away now, should be getting the first single in early July hopefully. And it's supposed to be darker and heavier, which I don't doubt after seeing Dirk's drum recording video where it looked like 3/4 of the songs had blastbeats in them lol.
 
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